Digi cameras

[schmalts]

Dis is da chit right here for wildlife shots when you need a zoom, most stores do not have them in stock and most are pre-sold. I would buy one myself but i am still having a hard time with the size of the camera. However, i just bought one on the company charge card for use at work here

http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/panasonic/dmc_fz10-review/index.shtml

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 12-22-2003 09:29: Message edited by: schmalts ]</font>

 

[1_pointer]

Thanks for the info on the SLR's guys. I will have one, just have a few other things to iron (ie buy) first. I have a film SLR and while fun and takes great pictures, it is purely manual focus. Which for a novice like me makes taking pics of critters tough. They always seem to move before I can get the light and focus set. But, I do want one with the option.

I'll look at the Rebel, as Canon has a good rep.

 

[JoseCuervo]

DGib,

Without following the link to the $788 Rebel, my guess is that it is for a "Body Only", and then, if you do buy it, it will be from a company in New York or New Jersey. Price an EF lens, and you soon approach the $1000 point.

The availability of the "Body Only" will be "usually ships in 2-3 weeks", after they call you, asking if you want to buy any accessories.

If you agree to the overpriced accessories, (Flash Card, Tripod, Filter, Lens Cleaner, and Private Label Lens), then they can ship it sooner. If you say no to the accessories, good luck.

I forgot the website (maybe Retailer.com?) but it had reviews on all the sellers at the low end of the Price Scans, and almost all of them had horror stories. Usually I like to shop around, but on this, I think I will take the $999 price at BestBuy for the Camera "Kit", that includes the Lens.

I know enough about SLR's to not need to go to the local Camera shop and pay $1300, that includes a free class and lens cleaner. But, I also know enough about Electronics to know that I want somebody who will be in business if I return it in 90 days.

Now of course, since the camera is not anywhere to be found, it is all an academic exercise, as Santa will not be able to deliver it on Thursday Morning...

My guess is by next Christmas, you will be able to buy a Digital SLR 6.x MP for $600. But then I would be missing another year in high quality Digital, and just relying on Film, which has only been around for 100 years...

 

[dgibson]

Just so, Gunner. It is all of the things you mention.

Sure, you can wait until next year for the 6Mp SLR for $600, but by then there will be an 8 or 9 Mp SLR for $1000 and you'll be wanting that instead.

Here's my thoughts on film, as a TV man and by no means a photography expert. Film, particularly 35mm film, has been around for a very long time indeed in technological terms. It is inherently grainy and just gets worse when you blow it up (have you ever really LOOKED at the quality of the picture on a movie screen, for cripes' sake!?!). Digital technology, on the other hand, keeps getting better and better, with more and more resolution, crisper images, and greater detail in every upgrade.

That said, what are digital cameras constantly compared to and pushed to emulate? 35mm film. What is the ultimate goal of HDTV and all its ilk? To make it look like 35mm film. People LIKE that grainy, filmy look. Harsh, detailed photography is for science; art dictates something with a little more character. I love new technology and would love to have an umpteen-megapixel digital camera, but I'm not quite ready to discount my film camera either!

That now takes me up to $0.04.

Let's see if the Threadkiller is on a roll!

 

[JoseCuervo]

l

And here is Sony's description of their soon to be available 8mp camera...
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Take a giant leap in digital photography. Sony's new Cyber-shot 8.0-megapixel digital camera gives you quality photography that truly rivals professional 35mm.
Designed with the serious photographer in mind, the Cyber-shot DSC-F828 is the only consumer-available digital camera to boast 8.0 megapixels for spectacular digital reproduction. Want to blow up that favorite photo? Enlargements come out beautifully, keeping their fine details and vibrant colors.

The first to have a Super HAD CCD with unique four-color filter, this new Cyber-shot boasts superb color accuracy — closer to what the human eye sees — while the Real Imaging Processor offers increased speed with lower power consumption. It takes an 8.0-MP image faster than a typical 5.0MP camera.

New manual controls, along with a Carl Zeiss-designed Vario-Sonnar T* lens, give advanced photographers a wealth of focus, exposure and recording options for all-around better picture quality results.

The DSC-F828's images easily store on CompactFlash Type I and Type II media, or on a Microdrive hard disk drive or Memory Stick PRO media.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

vs. the Digital Rebel

And the Canon description of....
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> 6.3-megapixel effective image resolution (6.5MP total) for outstanding photo detail; high-sensitivity, single-plate CMOS sensor with RGB primary color filter




18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 EF-S zoom lens with optimized coating for digital imaging, reducing ghost images and flare; Canon EF lens mount accommodates a wide range of Canon EOS EF lenses for a versatile shooting system that adapts to any circumstances




1.8" color TFT-LCD monitor with 118K pixels and 5-level brightness control; eye-level SLR viewfinder with adjustable diopter, fixed pentamirror and 0.8x magnification




Canon's high-speed DIGIC imaging processor works in tandem with the CMOS sensor to greatly reduce stray light and off colors for enhanced picture quality




7-point cross-pattern, wide-area autofocus with auto and manual point selection; modes include 1-shot, predictive AI servo, AI focus and full manual; TTL-CT-SIR (through-the-lens, secondary image registration)




Auto and manual exposure mode; program (settings for full auto, portrait, landscape, close-up, sports, night portrait, flash off), shutter- and aperture-priority, and depth-of-field AE; depth-of-field preview button




AE lock, FE lock and 3-image auto exposure bracketing; 3 exposure metering modes, including 35-zone evaluative (linked to AF points), partial center and centerweighted average




White balance settings for auto, daylight, shade, overcast, tungsten bulb, fluorescent light, flash, manual and custom; white balance bracketing captures 3 images with 1 shot (+/- 3 steps)




Built-in retractable E-TTL auto flash with auto pop-up, built-in red-eye reduction and 18mm lens angle coverage; automatic flash output reduction to balance illumination in backlit daytime conditions




Drive modes include single, continuous (4 shots at approx. 2.5 fps) and 10-sec. self-timer




CompactFlash Type I/II media slot (memory card not included); playback modes include single (with and without image info), 9-image index, magnification (1.5x to 10x with left/right and up/down scrolling), auto play and auto image rotation
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 12-23-2003 12:38: Message edited by: ElkGunner ]</font>

 

[dgibson]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Sony's new Cyber-shot 8.0-megapixel digital camera gives you quality photography that truly rivals professional 35mm.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I rest my case.

 

[JoseCuervo]

DGib,

You can't just rest your case, as that KILLS Threads!!!

I have had SLRs for 20 years, and I love the quality of the pictures from My Canon SLR, but the conveinence of Digital is becoming attractive.

I also like the ability to control shutter speeds and exposure settings, so my leaning is toward the SLR, but if I will soon regret not having 8MP, then I will be bummed...

 

[Oak]

If you want to see some outstanding pictures taken with the Canon 10D, go to Monstermuleys and do a search for "Saskman". Find threads that he started, and check out some of the pics he's taken. I know that megapixels don't make any difference on the net, but there's something about his pictures that makes them look about 10x better than anything I've seen from anyone else.

Oak

 

[dgibson]

Convenience is a very big factor, I'll grant you that! I HATE having to wait for pics.

Oak, I expect you'll find that the big difference between Saskman's and everyone else's pics is ability and experience. I have demonstrated that I can take the exact same picture of the exact same subject with the exact same camera as my father-in-law, one right after the other, and he gets a better pic--every time.

 

[Ovis]

I agree CO, Saskman takes some outstanding pics with that camera.

I can say one advantage of digital over SLR is the fact "learning" how to use the camera and all of it's options becomes much more easier with a digital as opposed to film.

If it were not for my digital, I would still be shooting either (boring) auto mode, or making over/under exposed pics with my Minolta SLR.

 

[RogueWarrior1957]

Convenience is the biggest advantage of digital cameras from my viewpoint. With a mid-range priced camera and a decent photo-ready printer, you can eliminate the photo shop guys for most practical purposes. You can't beat the convenience for adding your own snapshots to web-pages elimimating trying to scan a good image from a photo.

Like someone said earlier, digital cameras are like computers...soon outdated after you buy them. I bought a HP C618I a few years back when they were affiliated with Pentax. Pentax built the optics and mechanical part, and HP built the electronic part. It has been a great camera for my purposes, but there are much better cameras out there now for about the same money. I would not buy HP at this point, due to horrible service standings as of late.

One more point, then I'll give the countdown of the top ten. Get a camera with good optical zoom capabilities as well as the megapixel (MP) consideration. Basically anything over 3 megapixel will work adequately unless you're a professional photographer. Optical zoom is important because of the magnification power of the optics. Digital zoom narrows the view to a smaller area of interest on the pixel array, and when you enlarge, sometimes it is grainy. Optical zoom uses the whole pixel array.

In a range from $200 to $600 as per the January issue of PC World Magazine, the two best buys for the money are the Nikon Coolpix 3100 and the Cannon Powershot A70 @ $300 each, and 3.2 megapixel. Both have a decent optical zoom.
#3 is the Canon Powershot SD3100 Digital Elpf @ $300...it's forte is it's small size (about the size of a pack of cigarettes), downside it lacks on optical zoom.
#4 Kodak Easyshare DX6440 @ $400, fantastic optical zoom, 4 MP.
#5 Pentax Optio 555 @ $550, great optical zoom, 5 MP.
#6 Sony Cybershot DSC-P10 @$450, says photo quality unimpressive

.
#7 Kyocera Finecam L3v @ $250, bargain priced camera with aperture-priority override, 3.2 MP.
#8 Minolta DiMage G500 @ $400, high resolution, good image quality, 5 MP.
#9 Fujifilm Finepix F700 @ $500, good optical zoom plus high 6.2 MP, includes both shutter and aperture priority exposure modes.
#10 Minolta DiMage Xt @ $300, small size, good optical zoom, and improved controls are this ones forte. 3.2 MP

I hope this will help someone in making their selection. I figured hey, I get the magazine, so I'm glad to pass along the information.

Good luck,

 

[brassmonkey]

I got a Kodak DX 4330 a little over a year ago and love it. It was on sale for $279, plus another $70 for the docking station. It's treated me very well so far. It's 3.1 megapixel and also has a video mode. At the best photo taking, it does take photo quality pictures. I took some pictures one time and compared them to pictures taken with my wife's 35mm, and you can't tell the difference.

 

[RogueWarrior1957]

Fortunately for you guys, I don't know how to post images to the board yet.

Have any of you ever tried to take pictures of the moon, or something else with low light? I wasted film doing bracketed shots for years, only to be disappointed. When we had the lunar eclipse back in May 2003, I shot some professional looking frames of the moon in eclipse. What I found through expiramentation was to set the digital camera on a tripod, put it in full auto mode with flash over-ridden, and used the remote to snap off shots. The tripod is a must, because of the extremely slow shutter speed necessary to catch a dim image. No matter how still you think you are, you'll get fuzzy images without the tripod. I got about 17 frames of the lunar eclipse that were magazine quality. One was actually published in my local paper. Now I'm imagining what it could do with low-light game animal shots.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 01-03-2004 10:38: Message edited by: RogueWarrior1957 ]</font>

 

[Ovis]

Rogue

I've taken a few shots of the moon, but my favorite type of night photography is of the aurora borealis. I love to hunt the aurora, and have a number of fantastic shots.

Any low light photography requires a tripod or a very steady hand...preferably the tripod, because as you stated, the slightest movement and you'll get a blur.

 

[RogueWarrior1957]

One day I hope to visit the your area,

vis. Down here at the 37th parallel, we seldom get even a hint of the aurora borealis. One time when I used to work shift work, due to a fluke condition of some type, we did catch a glimpse of the aurora. With the filtering effect of the atmosphere at the viewing angle, it appeared as a flickering orange-red glow on the northern horizon...kind of like what a distant forest fire would cause. Would be nice to see the real thing first hand instead of just what I've seen on TV.

-RW-

 

[Ovis]

I have not seen the aurora since living in Idaho. All of my northern lights hunting took place in Alaska. It was almost a daily show during the winter there.

 

[schmalts]

Thanks for the list of cameras. But has anyone but me looked at the new Panasonic???
It has not had any reviews yet because its new but it will blow away all of the listed cameras with high zoom. Its 12X optical Leica lense and Imaga stabilization ROCKS!!!
Deerking Just bought one and so far he really likes it. I played with one at the store and took pics with and without the image stabilizer on and it was a huge difference. Those who want great wildlife high zoom shots without dragging a tripod everywhere need to check out this camera!!

 

[Ovis]

Face it schmalts, the panasonic sucks! Image stabilization is for people who don't know how to use a tripod

 

[schmalts]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ovis:
Face it schmalts, the panasonic sucks! Image stabilization is for people who don't know how to use a tripod

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Face it Ovis, tripods are for guys who cant hunt and take pictures instead

I will carry a bow instead of a tripod

 

[Ovis]

Little different carrying a bow up a treestand, and actually stalking, but hey...if you say so.

Actually, I gave you the benefit of the doubt, and looked at some reviews on the camera at www.dpreview.com . It does appear to be an "okay"

camera. However, the big drawback is in low light situations. It also lacks in MP and has crappy glass. I don't care for the body either, but again...it isn't a bad camera.

One question for you though...what does a hard core bowhunter need a 12x zoom for if it is your nature to get up close and personal with these animals?