Dealing with Insurance and a house fire

[Pagosa]

On December 19th we lost our home in Kalispell due to a house fire, it started on the rear deck by a tenant unintentionally spilling hot coals, or dumping ashes to close to the house. We were in Minnesota working and had the house leased out, and currently working with our insurance adjuster.
From speaking with them yesterday they are not for sure I will be covered since my policy was not a landlord policy. I had specifically discussed this with my agent and he said the house (dwelling) and personal items would be covered per the limits. We have the same exact policy on another duplex with Allstate. The policy doesn’t say it’s not covered if rented out. But the adjuster has asked for the lease agreement and still sorting out the details.
If I’m not covered, what would be possible course of legal action to recoup my loss? Should I contact an attorney now? Or am I just better off to sell the land with deattached garage and adjacent property and start over some place else. I built the property myself and have a little over 205k in materials, not counting my volunteer labor. Land values are nuts right now in Kalispell and we are considering moving to a different area. Any sound advice would be greatly appreciated. Lesson learned is always check your insurance coverage.

 

[utah400elk]

I work in LE and have been involved in numerous fire investigations. You need to find a professional adjuster NOW! In most big fires, people and companies hire professional adjusters (might not be the technically proper name). Your insurance is not your friend. The professional adjuster cost a lot (please don’t quote me but I think the standard is 10%).

They can be a huge help in dealing with you adjuster. At the very least try and consult with one. Not sure what the total on your claim would be but definitely worth your time to call.

 

[Southern Elk]

That’s terrible. Do you have anything in writing from the agent? I thought it was common knowledge that you needed a landlord policy for a rental.

 

[SD_Prairie_Goat]

Get your policy documents, not the short three page version that gives highlights, but the long one that is like 100 pages.

Read through that one and see if there's a call out for excluding rented property.


Fyi, agents are terrible. They don't really know what they're selling, or the limits of it. We get screwed by their mistake. For my house fire, they wouldn't cover my GF's stuff because we're not married. Not a word from my agent...


Pm me if you want to chat, went through it myself with all state as well

 

[Pagosa]

I appreciate it guys, and I just looked up professional insurance adjusters and will call several on Monday. This is the direction we need to go.

Southern Elk, I took the agent at face value we had three rental properties under the same provisions coverage. It was my mistake for just reading the three page disclosure and not the entire 100 page document.

 

[Southern Elk]

I appreciate it guys, and I just looked up professional insurance adjusters and will call several on Monday. This is the direction we need to go.

Southern Elk, I took the agent at face value we had three rental properties under the same provisions coverage. It was my mistake for just reading the three page disclosure and not the entire 100 page document.

I would have trusted him too. Mine told me I needed a landlord policy in a similar situation. It’s a shame. I hope you can get your money.

 

[Nick87]

No advice Preston but I hope it works out for you. Sorry to hear this.

 

[CUElk]

Pm me if you would like to talk. Been in the insurance biz for 25 years. Not sure what the laws are in MT, but here a public adjuster cannot get involved in coverage issues which is exactly what you have. Once you sign a contract with them, they get 10% minimum, no way out. There are some avenues for coverage. Depends on how the policy is written and state laws. Possible coverage under the agents error and omissions coverage as well. Be glad to help.

 

[Pagosa]

Pm me if you would like to talk. Been in the insurance biz for 25 years. Not sure what the laws are in MT, but here a public adjuster cannot get involved in coverage issues which is exactly what you have. Once you sign a contract with them, they get 10% minimum, no way out. There are some avenues for coverage. Depends on how the policy is written and state laws. Possible coverage under the agents error and omissions coverage as well. Be glad to help.

I was wondering about the agents error and omissions on selling me these policies since 2017, we transferred them over from a builders risk to a homeowner policy which was the direction of my agent. I’m going to call an 3rd party adjuster next week. East

 

[CUElk]

That’s definitely an error on the part of the agent if he knew you were leasing out and still directed you to a homeowners policy. Make sure the public adjuster can get involved in coverage before going that route. I would try to resolve on my own first before going with a PA. Would hate to see you give away that much money. An attorney would likely handle for much much less, just so you know.

 

[Addicting]

Sorry for your loss. Did your renters have insurance with a renters policy?

 

[Sytes]

I don't know much about the insurance side of life though I hired an attorney in that field of practice (Medical: claimed even though I was advised I was covered, ultimately I paid because fine print crap... took it to the State to review the insurance claim). Why?
"I don't know much about the insurance side of life"
A quality attorney in that field of practice who's actions are specific to your interest is gold. From dealing with insurance companies to adjusters.
They may cost though, if they're specialized in this field, it's likely worth consultation to feel out the setting.

Also, likely best to keep less info on public forums and keep your cards close to your chest, with your attorney or advisor.

Best to you Preston! You've always shared a valued friendly approach in past discussions. You need assistance with moving items, I've the next four days off. Touch base.

 

[Pagosa]

Thanks Charles, advice well taken, and I got the direction and help I needed. I appreciate you guys advice.

 

[Pagosa]

Sorry for your loss. Did your renters have insurance with a renters policy?

Yes

 

[Addicting]

Yes

A good question on it would be if it covered just the renters contents or their negligences on the structure as well.

 

[Pagosa]

A good question on it would be if it covered just the renters contents or their negligences on the structure as well.

Valid point

 

[Farmerj]

As a renter,…

My renters insurance covers only
My personal property…

Or the dwelling if something I do…(stove or oven fire) burns the house down.

The landlord insurance would pay out if something like a bad wiring causes a fire and destroys the house.

This came up again and was confirmed when my dad rented his basement out to a couple that is in the process of building a house and their landlord sold the property they were renting.

Landlord insurance is a separate policy all in its own.

Since this was caused by the tenant using a coal grill on a wood deck, serious fire code violation on a multi-family dwelling, your policy is likely not to cover your house.

I built a deck onto the house and it was the specific scenario I asked how it would be covered.

I also asked them what would happen if the house had a fire and someone came it to “clean up” afterwards…

A person I’m familiar with had a structure fire. It was extinguished before leaving the room that was point of origin, but the water and smoke damage were extensive. The bill was over $60,000 for the cleaning and another $15,000 for lost property.

The $60,000 service master bill was NOT covered by their policy.

It was another item that had to be added. Lesson learn At the expense of another’s loss.

 

[KoolBreeze]

Think I'd talk with an attorney that I trusted to represent my interests and advise me on how to proceed.

 

[Bambistew]

Damn. That's a tough situation, I have nothing to offer but best of luck with all of it. Sounds like appreciation and the stupid housing market will help take out the sting whatever it may be.

 

[Pucky Freak]

I went through an ugly property insurance claim in 2020. Some general advice:
-Take notes on every phone conversation, including the person’s name.
-Don’t let time lapse on persons getting back to you in a timely manner. Be a squeaky wheel if you need to. I was ghosted by 4 persons involved in my claim.
-Try not to touch, fix, or salvage anything on the property until the adjuster takes pictures. It can and will lead to them shorting you on the payout.
-If you sense that anyone in the process is giving you the runaround or BS’ing you, promptly talk to their supervisor (be a Karen).
-Check the claim summary with great scrutiny. Don’t let them get away with underpaying you for labor, materials, or just plain leaving things out.
-Your agent may have been a helpful, friendly person when you purchased coverage, but they have little incentive to make sure you get a fair, expedient payout on a claim.

My policy did not have my shed on it, but I thought it did prior to a tree that crushed it. My agent knew I had a shed and talked about it as if it was covered. When I first got coverage I even sent pictures of the shed to the underwriter. I read the entire policy and it seemed clear that the shed was covered. When I made the claim they just said it’s not covered, it was my responsibility to review the policy, and notice the omission. I considered suing, but eventually decided to just fix the building myself. Ended up being over 1k in materials and me and my buddy did the work to avoid paying someone else thousands. I also got screwed when they promised a second payment for supplemental repairs on my garage, and I never got a dime. I kept getting BS excuses, and I’m pretty sure I could have sued and won in that case, but again just shelled out another $1500 for materials and did all the labor myself to be done with it.