Chinese surveillance balloon over Montana?

[tarheel]

Although the balloon flew overhead here I'm more concerned with the potential target map in the event of the big shootout with China.

I think I'll move to Happy Camp, CA. I'm ringed in here and downwind of a lot of crap.

 

[IH784]

Y’all gonna pop it or what? Probably could pop it with a cripplemore.

 

[VikingsGuy]

So why did we just shoot it down?

https://twitter.com/x/status/1621998506570293254

Funny how they had a top notch recollection of obscure military history. Frankly, (pun intended) I would have preferred the DOD have a cursory undergraduate knowledge of physics and geography and found a place to drop it in Alaska, Montana or ND before it completed its mission.

 

[manitou1]

Funny how they had a top notch recollection of obscure military history. Frankly, (pun intended) I would have preferred the DOD have a cursory undergraduate knowledge of physics and geography and found a place to drop it in Alaska, Montana or ND before it completed its mission.

Yup... the damage is done now.

 

[MarvB]

Although the balloon flew overhead here I'm more concerned with the potential target map in the event of the big shootout with China.

I think I'll move to Happy Camp, CA. I'm ringed in here and downwind of a lot of crap.

Ok @tarheel I’ve gotta ask as we used to log there YEARS ago, how the hell do you know about Happy Camp CA?

 

[gouch]

It turns out that this is the 5th time in the last several years that China has floated spy balloons over us. I would imagine we have gotten pretty good at feeding misinformation to those things by now.

 

[schmalts]

Funny how they had a top notch recollection of obscure military history. Frankly, (pun intended) I would have preferred the DOD have a cursory undergraduate knowledge of physics and geography and found a place to drop it in Alaska, Montana or ND before it completed its mission.

No kidding, my thoughts exactly. In WW2 bombers flew overhead over 20000 feet and were able to calculate the speed and altitude and winds would make a dropped object land on X. These modern day knuckleheads with supercomputers could not figure out a place to drop it over a couple of the least populated states in the country?

 

[noharleyyet]

 

[FI460]

Although the balloon flew overhead here I'm more concerned with the potential target map in the event of the big shootout with China.

I think I'll move to Happy Camp, CA. I'm ringed in here and downwind of a lot of crap.

Ok @tarheel I’ve gotta ask as we used to log there YEARS ago, how the hell do you know about Happy Camp CA?

Grew up near Happy Camp. I'll take the nukes over moving there.

 

[gouch]

Grew up near Happy Camp. I'll take the nukes over moving there.

I haven't been there in quite a while but with all the fires they've had in the last few years, it probably looks like it's already been nuked.

 

[shoots-straight]

I don't think a clandestine balloon would be colored white. Don't you think that if they wished it to go undetected that it would have been a blue color? Camo'ed some sort of blue and white?

I believe it might very well have been a weather type balloon and Biden and company knew that, but are using it for political browny points.

 

[noharleyyet]

Why was the F-22 used to shoot down a spy balloon?​

On Saturday, the F-22 scored its first “air-to-air” combat kill. Using a $400,000 AIM 9X Sidewinder missile, the F-22 destroyed the balloon with observers claiming that they “felt” the explosion, before the balloon dropped into the ocean. Many observers questioned the need of using such an expensive jet to take down something relatively harmless, such as a high-altitude balloon.


However, the balloon’s altitude might have had something to do with the decision. Among the fighters the U.S. possesses, the F-22 has the highest service ceiling and is the most capable of conducting a precision strike at those heights. According to the Department of Defence, the F-22 fired the Sidewinder at the balloon from an altitude of 58,000 feet. The balloon at the time was between 60,000 and 65,000 feet.

Most fighter jets operate at lower altitudes and even if they are theoretically capable of reaching altitudes that the balloon was flying in, there are questions with regard to their operational capabilities at those heights.

Why the US used an F-22 aircraft to shoot down the alleged spy balloon from China

The U.S. has the world’s largest and most advanced air force in the world with the F-22 Raptor as its crown jewel.

indianexpress.com

 

[SAJ-99]

No kidding, my thoughts exactly. In WW2 bombers flew overhead over 20000 feet and were able to calculate the speed and altitude and winds would make a dropped object land on X. These modern day knuckleheads with supercomputers could not figure out a place to drop it over a couple of the least populated states in the country?

Let's not have grandiose delusions of history. In WWII, they carpet bombed targets with dozens of bombers and often missed the X completely.

 

[VikingsGuy]

Let's not have grandiose delusions of history. In WWII, they carpet bombed targets with dozens of bombers and often missed the X completely.

Let’s update the perspective - we track the trajectory of asteroids for millions of miles traveling thousands of miles per hour. We also track incoming supersonic missiles with sufficient accuracy to nail them with a Patriot missile system. Safely bringing down in Alaska, northwest Canada or Montana was not beyond our technical means by any stretch of the imagination. It’s not rocket science . . . Uhhhh . . . Wait . . . Actually it is rocket science

 

[SAJ-99]

Let’s update the perspective - we track the trajectory of asteroids for millions of miles traveling thousands of miles per hour. We also track incoming supersonic missiles with sufficient accuracy to nail them with a Patriot missile system. Safely bringing down in Alaska, northwest Canada or Montana was not beyond our technical means by any stretch of the imagination. It’s not rocket science . . . Uhhhh . . . Wait . . . Actually it is rocket science

I agree, although an asteroid is more predictable than earth's wind. Remember the "please keep seat belt buckled" on any flight? Maybe military thought pieces could be more easily collected over water? Perspective is great. But people will just fit it to their narrative. Apparently it's the 5th balloon in the last two administrations. The military says it prevented it from collecting data . Not sure why they shot this one down and not the others. All the kerfuffle after this is just political noise.

 

[noharleyyet]

Let’s update the perspective - we track the trajectory of asteroids for millions of miles traveling thousands of miles per hour. We also track incoming supersonic missiles with sufficient accuracy to nail them with a Patriot missile system. Safely bringing down in Alaska, northwest Canada or Montana was not beyond our technical means by any stretch of the imagination. It’s not rocket science . . . Uhhhh . . . Wait . . . Actually it is rocket science

This thread's contentiousness;

It's not confirmation bias . . Uhhhh . . . Wait . . .

Actually it is confirmation bias.

 

[theat]

No kidding, my thoughts exactly. In WW2 bombers flew overhead over 20000 feet and were able to calculate the speed and altitude and winds would make a dropped object land on X. These modern day knuckleheads with supercomputers could not figure out a place to drop it over a couple of the least populated states in the country?

“For the U.S. Army Air Forces, daylight bombing was normal based upon box formations for defense from fighters. Bombing was coordinated through a lead aircraft but although still nominally precision bombing (as opposed to the area bombing carried out by RAF Bomber Command) the result of bombing from high level was still spread over an area. Before the war on practice ranges, some USAAF crews were able to produce very accurate results, but over Europe with weather and German fighters and anti-aircraft guns and the limited training for new crews this level of accuracy was impossible to reproduce. The US defined the target area as being a 1,000 ft (300 m) radius circle around the target point - for the majority of USAAF attacks only about 20% of the bombs dropped struck in this area. The U.S. daytime bombing raids were more effective in reducing German defences by engaging the German Luftwaffe than destruction of the means of aircraft production.

An example of the difficulties of precision bombing was a raid in the Northern Hemisphere summer of 1944 by 47 B-29's on Japan's Yawata Steel Works from bases in China. Only one plane actually hit the target area, and only with one of its bombs. This single 500 lb (230 kg) general-purpose bomb represented one quarter of one percent of the 376 bombs dropped over Yawata on that mission. It took 108 B-17 bombers, crewed by 1,080 airmen, dropping 648 bombs to guarantee a 96 percent chance of getting just two hits inside a 400 x 500 ft (150 m) German power-generation plant.”

 

[schmalts]

“For the U.S. Army Air Forces, daylight bombing was normal based upon box formations for defense from fighters. Bombing was coordinated through a lead aircraft but although still nominally precision bombing (as opposed to the area bombing carried out by RAF Bomber Command) the result of bombing from high level was still spread over an area. Before the war on practice ranges, some USAAF crews were able to produce very accurate results, but over Europe with weather and German fighters and anti-aircraft guns and the limited training for new crews this level of accuracy was impossible to reproduce. The US defined the target area as being a 1,000 ft (300 m) radius circle around the target point - for the majority of USAAF attacks only about 20% of the bombs dropped struck in this area. The U.S. daytime bombing raids were more effective in reducing German defences by engaging the German Luftwaffe than destruction of the means of aircraft production.

An example of the difficulties of precision bombing was a raid in the Northern Hemisphere summer of 1944 by 47 B-29's on Japan's Yawata Steel Works from bases in China. Only one plane actually hit the target area, and only with one of its bombs. This single 500 lb (230 kg) general-purpose bomb represented one quarter of one percent of the 376 bombs dropped over Yawata on that mission. It took 108 B-17 bombers, crewed by 1,080 airmen, dropping 648 bombs to guarantee a 96 percent chance of getting just two hits inside a 400 x 500 ft (150 m) German power-generation plant.”

You guys are missing the point. They did not have to put this thing down the smokestack of a factory. You want to tell me there is no areas in montana or dakotas where there is 20 or 30 square miles without a house? I know for a fact there is. There is some fudge factor there. If I can lead a clay in sporting clays and shoot a 47 out of 50 I think the men in black can figure a 30 mile area this thing would fall on

 

[tjones]

Shooting it down seemed kinda boring.

I has hoping for something more like Bruce Willis landing on an asteroid and torching off a nuke.

 

[theat]

You guys are missing the point. They did not have to put this thing down the smokestack of a factory. You want to tell me there is no areas in montana or dakotas where there is 20 or 30 square miles without a house? I know for a fact there is. There is some fudge factor there. If I can lead a clay in sporting clays and shoot a 47 out of 50 I think the men in black can figure a 30 mile area this thing would fall on

Just out of curiosity, are you guys that are so mad at the current resident of the White House that did shoot down the balloon, equally as mad at Trump for letting TWO similar Chinese balloons cross the US without doing anything during his presidency? I trust our military enough to believe them when they say that the balloons posed no threat to our military or the country. Just maybe, perhaps they know more about the balloons capabilities and threat than us yahoos wanting to plink at it with our Creedmoors??