Chance to "hunt" goats in Olympic Park

[kwyeewyk]

Thought this was interesting, remember a recent thread about using public to control bison in YNP, here's your chance:

WDFW WILDLIFE PROGRAM
Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife
600 Capitol Way North, Olympia, WA 98501-1091
[email protected]


Olympic National Park is recruiting skilled volunteers to assist with the lethal removal of non-native mountain goats from the park. Selected volunteers will be required to travel on foot up to 15 miles a day through park wilderness, much of which will be off trail in predominantly steep and extremely challenging terrain.

• This program will occur from Sept. 9 - Oct. 17, 2020.
• In order to participate, volunteers must apply in groups of 3-6 people, and participate in one of three scheduled removal sessions.

Participants must:

• attend one day of training at the beginning of each designated removal session
• pass a background check
• meet requirements for physical fitness, orienteering, and experience recreating in extensive mountainous wilderness.

Groups may consist of field support personnel and expert marksmen; only those who pass a firearms proficiency test (which will be administered during each training) will be permitted to shoot goats in the park. Each group must have at least one person that passes the firearms proficiency test.


Volunteers must supply all their own required equipment and supplies, including suitable firearms and non-toxic ammunition.


Applications will be accepted until at least April 17. After that date, it will close as soon as 30 qualified groups apply, or on April 24 (whichever comes first).


For the past three years the Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife has been a partner with Olympic National Park and many other organizations in this effort to return the ecosystem to a natural state. Thank you for considering participation in this important effort to remove nonnative mountain goats from the Olympic National Park.


Please visit nps.gov/olym/getinvolved/mountain-goat-management-removal.htm for more information.

 

[MTGomer]

Any idea if they get to/have to keep meat and have the option to keep the head/cape?

 

[Irrelevant]

Any idea if they get to/have to keep meat and have the option to keep the head/cape?

you can keep the meat, not the hide or head.

 

[Gerald Martin]

Part of me would be intrigued by the experience. Having been on multiple goat hunts, I don’t think I would enjoy being the one on the gun and having to kill every one you see.
I think it would ruin goat hunting for me.

 

[Irrelevant]

Part of me would be intrigued by the experience. Having been on multiple goat hunts, I don’t think I would enjoy being the one on the gun and having to kill every one you see.
I think it would ruin goat hunting for me.

that, and the 40 deg rain for 10 days...all 3 feet of it.

 

[Deleted member 16014]

What a place to hunt, but no thanks.

 

[rtraverdavis]

If this goes down, I imagine it will not be a good look for hunters.

 

[dgc1963]

If anyones getting a team together for this let me know I could be interested many things I dont like but if its going to be done its still a goat hunt

 

[daltrix99]

Myself and two of my buddies/hunting partners are interested in this. We are all prior military and experienced backcountry hunters in western MT. My questions for the forum, especially those familiar with Olympic NP/this issue:

• What is the goat population like in the park? Relatively small, large, widely dispersed, etc.?
• How horrendous is the terrain where they live?
• What is the rain like from early Sep-mid Oct? Would either end of that window be more or less dry?
• Is this the right thing to do, both from a wildlife management perspective, and from a 'hunter perception' angle? I am not familiar with goat management in WA.

Thoughts appreciated; thanks.

 

[Mtnhunter1]

I love goats and the country that they call home,,,,this kind of eradication turns my stomach!!!

 

[44hunter45]

Try this URL if all you are getting is COVID-19 updates. Expand the word documents for more detailed info. Yes, you can keep the meat (but not the horns?) Monolithic bullets required. Provide you own weapon and ammo, etc.

Mountain Goat Management - How to Volunteer - Olympic National Park (U.S. National Park Service)

www.nps.gov

 

[R.K.]

I love goats and the country that they call home,,,,this kind of eradication turns my stomach!!!

The thing here, is that this is a non native population. I understand where you're coming from, and the high potential for bad coverage on hunters.

I would like to see the supporting research for the decision to remove goats from the parks, and evaluate why it is happening. But overall, I think this could be a great opportunity to hunt goats for anyone willing to put up with the weather and terrain.

 

[Irrelevant]

Myself and two of my buddies/hunting partners are interested in this. We are all prior military and experienced backcountry hunters in western MT. My questions for the forum, especially those familiar with Olympic NP/this issue:

• What is the goat population like in the park? Relatively small, large, widely dispersed, etc.?
• How horrendous is the terrain where they live?
• What is the rain like from early Sep-mid Oct? Would either end of that window be more or less dry?
• Is this the right thing to do, both from a wildlife management perspective, and from a 'hunter perception' angle? I am not familiar with goat management in WA.

Thoughts appreciated; thanks.

1. They were very high, that was prior to 3 summers of removals (3rd being this summer). I would imagine they're going to be in the nastiest of the nastiest after that kind of harassment.
2. So horrendous if you don't feel comfortable on belay I wouldn't bother. Many of the units will require glacier travel if you want to effectively hunt the entire unit. This will be glacier travel either with the majority of the cravasses are open or just after they get covered up with a skiff a snow, but before they are safe to travel over. From what I've seen of the Rockies they don't compare to this kind of terrain except if some very small spots (Teitons, GNP).
3. Could be great, but more than likely it'll be rain and snow and a low cloud deck the entire trip. I spend all of august in the Park one summer and got rained on every day.
4. 100% the right thing to do, but you are being asked to shoot every goat you see, every nannie, every kid. Then you need to access the bodies and bring back biological samples.

A lot of the units require 20+ trail miles to access. And the possibility that you will be spending the entire trip wet.

I've done some legit mountaineering, but mostly just scrabbles. I like to hunt the alpine, but I don't think I'm qualified for this hunt. I talked to the NPS yesterday and they're very concerned that they're going to get hunters applying, they really feel like it needs to be a team of mountaineers with someone that can pull a trigger.

 

[daltrix99]

1. They were very high, that was prior to 3 summers of removals (3rd being this summer). I would imagine they're going to be in the nastiest of the nastiest after that kind of harassment.
2. So horrendous if you don't feel comfortable on belay I wouldn't bother. Many of the units will require glacier travel if you want to effectively hunt the entire unit. This will be glacier travel either with the majority of the cravasses are open or just after they get covered up with a skiff a snow, but before they are safe to travel over. From what I've seen of the Rockies they don't compare to this kind of terrain except if some very small spots (Teitons, GNP).
3. Could be great, but more than likely it'll be rain and snow and a low cloud deck the entire trip. I spend all of august in the Park one summer and got rained on every day.
4. 100% the right thing to do, but you are being asked to shoot every goat you see, every nannie, every kid. Then you need to access the bodies and bring back biological samples.

A lot of the units require 20+ trail miles to access. And the possibility that you will be spending the entire trip wet.

I've done some legit mountaineering, but mostly just scrabbles. I like to hunt the alpine, but I don't think I'm qualified for this hunt. I talked to the NPS yesterday and they're very concerned that they're going to get hunters applying, they really feel like it needs to be a team of mountaineers with someone that can pull a trigger.

Well, this was an eye-opening list! My interest went to zero while reading this. If we are going to do something in September besides elk hunt, we'll probably stick to the MT unlimited adventure...

Thanks for the helpful reply!

 

[LopeHunter]

1. They were very high, that was prior to 3 summers of removals (3rd being this summer). I would imagine they're going to be in the nastiest of the nastiest after that kind of harassment.
2. So horrendous if you don't feel comfortable on belay I wouldn't bother. Many of the units will require glacier travel if you want to effectively hunt the entire unit. This will be glacier travel either with the majority of the cravasses are open or just after they get covered up with a skiff a snow, but before they are safe to travel over. From what I've seen of the Rockies they don't compare to this kind of terrain except if some very small spots (Teitons, GNP).
3. Could be great, but more than likely it'll be rain and snow and a low cloud deck the entire trip. I spend all of august in the Park one summer and got rained on every day.
4. 100% the right thing to do, but you are being asked to shoot every goat you see, every nannie, every kid. Then you need to access the bodies and bring back biological samples.

A lot of the units require 20+ trail miles to access. And the possibility that you will be spending the entire trip wet.

I've done some legit mountaineering, but mostly just scrabbles. I like to hunt the alpine, but I don't think I'm qualified for this hunt. I talked to the NPS yesterday and they're very concerned that they're going to get hunters applying, they really feel like it needs to be a team of mountaineers with someone that can pull a trigger.

Appreciate the scoop on what this effort will be like as I have been on two goat hunts, AK and OR, where was in some steep stuff and was thinking maybe, maybe, just maybe, this was an adventure for me. Nope. Also, if can't keep the horns then even less interest if this really was merely a nice hike in the alpine meadows while doing my best Julie Andrews twirl at the top of each hour.

 

[EYJONAS!]

Would be an interesting experience to say the least huh @MTGomer ?

 

[MTGomer]

It sure is... I know a few guys that guide glacier goat hunts in the Chugach that would excel at this. At that time of the year, however, they are guiding glacial goat hunts in the Chugach.

 

[furness]

A lot of their push to get rid of the goats started about 9-10 years ago when a guy in his 60s decided to harass a goat blocking the hiking trail he was on. After all, the goat has less call to be on the trail, right? Anyway, the goat got tired of being harassed & got him with a horn & he died. Ever since then there’s been this huge effort to get all of the goats out of the park.

 

[Irrelevant]

I know likr three people that would be qualified, but only one hunts and his #2 little one is due around that time, I think the others would prefer to be in the Cascades or Rockies during that time (where it's not shitty weather and the aspens are golden). However, I know about 30 people who will be applying for this hunt. Some of those people I would question if they could do a single 15 mile day let alone with 50lbs or more on their back, let alone off trail, let alone in some incredibly steep nasty brushy terrain, let alone for 7 days straight. That is what the NPS is up against. I would assume Tieton NP will be looking at how this goes to decide what they do it in the future with their aerial gunning goat removal was stopped due to the outcry (I think, I could have missed something with that one).

 

[Irrelevant]

I've only heard about this hunt and the goat management in the park in passing. This page helped me to understand what's going on quite a bit- https://www.nps.gov/olym/planyourvisit/mountain-goat-capture-and-translocation.htm

Maybe someone here knows, but I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around WHY they're going this direction, rather than straight to aerial gunning. They explicitly say that hunting is not allowed in the park, and you can tell that they're make sure to never call this a hunt anywhere. It doesn't feel to me like this is a token gift sportsman to give them an opportunity. Is it a cost thing? Helicopter time isn't cheap. Is it a visibility issue, with wanting to remove these goats in off-visitor season?

I'm not against it, I'm just curious to know what pushed them in this direction, compared to what happened in the Tetons. No doubt they'll eventually have to go to aerial gunning. Even in the Tendoys they weren't able to remove all the sheep by using hunters, and this is MUCH more extreme terrain for hunters to get around in.

I do appreciate that they've been taking so many goats across the sound to the Cascades. That's a huge population to kill off. Would have been really cool to have some of them brought over to Northern Idaho and NW Montana where native populations are circling the drain.

I believe that it actually is about opportunity. I've heard that there was a big push by several groups to allow sportsmen some opportunity.

They're getting to the point where it's getting pretty hard to capture them, they've gone into the steep stuff were you just can't net them safely. Aerial gunning will definitely be used to cleanup the stragglers.