Call your Senators! CPW Commission Confirmation Vote - Delayed Again! Now Tues, 12 Mar!

[Deleted member 52098]

How do you collaborate with groups that want to eliminate you? Lots of hunting, fishing, wildlife conservation, and outdoor recreation groups collaborated to oppose this appointment. They were completely ignored by the Gov and the majority of the Senators.

I am not sure you do... BUT hunters could be doing a much better job of positioning themselves with the third crowd here - those who are neither anti hunting, nor a hunter. We don't engage that group near as well as could and often our rhetoric straight up makes us look JUST like the anti hunting crowd paints us (shoot shovel shutup being the top of that list).

I have a lot more to say on this, but sometimes an Internet forum isn't the best place.

Hunters do a lot of good and I would argue care as much, if not more, about these animals than the anti hunting crowd... but we tend to fight within our ranks rather than putting our differences aside and mounting a unified effort.

 

[Green Hunter]

@MtnElk - Agreed - thanks for redirecting that constructively

 

[cedahm]

It is crazy. Amazing how bloated the Colorado State Government has become...

I'm not implying there aren't wasteful processes in government - absolutely true beyond a reasonable doubt.

But I think the graph below has the most influence on the growth of various state government orgs. We've grown by "3.5 Wyoming's" since I moved here 27 years ago.

e.g. The equivalent of the entire Cheyenne Metro population plus everyone in Rawlins has moved to CO every single year over that span. Public orgs are going to grow with the population:

Colorado - resident population 2022 | Statista

In 2022, about 5.84 million people lived in Colorado.

www.statista.com

tl;dr - email your state Senator

 

[perma]

Well shoot, sorry CO. Don’t let off the pedal. I’ll go to bat with you guys as much as I can.

 

[Sytes]

From Colorado Politics

The vote on Beaulieu was 19 to 15, with four Democrats — Roberts, and Sens. Rachel Zenzinger, James Coleman and Nick Hinrichsen — voting against, along with the Senate's 11 Republicans. (One was excused for a funeral).

The final tally was not surprising. What was surprising was the other user groups who also opposed this particular nominee. Mountain bikers, snowmobilers, stock growers, and hunters. Regardless of her positions on hunting, Beaulieu is clearly unqualified and does not meet the requirements of the position. Yet the good senators confirmed her.

The rest of the legislative week is full of anti-gun bills. So that should be great.

Yuck. They sure know how to target States ripe for the taking... Washington and now Colorado. Who's next on Center for B.S. Diversity's agenda? I'm sure we shall see.
If a Republican Governor, would they have been nominated? Give up some aspects, gain others. Nature of politics.

Colorado Senate Confirms Animal Rights Advocates to Wildlife Commission

The Colorado State Senate voted today to confirm two new wildlife commissioners who both have backgrounds in animal rights and animal welfare. In July of last year, Colorado Governor Jared Polis announced the appointment of Jess Beaulieu of Denver, John (Jack) Murphy of Aurora, and Gary Skiba of...

www.themeateater.com

 

[Sytes]

Well shoot, sorry CO. Don’t let off the pedal. I’ll go to bat with you guys as much as I can.

We must.

The national and international eco-enviro / animal "rights" operations are feeding off wins as cheered within their newsletters.
It's funding their coffers and expanding their horizons.

This is not a Colorado issue.

 

[Ben Lamb]

This should really be a major wake up call to hunters, anglers, and outdoor rec users in Colorado. We knew Polis has an anti-hunting agenda but we now know that the anti-hunting extremists also control the Senate. They have the ability to completely shut out the voice of sportsmen and women in those districts.

I was really disappointed to see folks like Priola and Exum from Weld and El Paso county vote to confirm. Exum is a former firefighter from the springs! Every firefighter I know is a hunter, many guide and outfit, how would he defend that kind of vote in a firehouse?

We really need a Political Action Committee specifically focused on state elected officials. Publish some type of “Sportpersons’ Voting Guide”, so hunters and anglers know who is voting against their interests. Identify those candidates and support their opposition in primaries and general elections.

Rather than spend time on PAC's that tilt at windmills, if those two individuals would have voted with you, you'd have won on a split vote. So, if they're going to be coming back for the foreseable future, get to know them after the session, or when they come back to town. Be a valued source rather than just a pissed off voice they hear from once every session or so.

 

[perma]

This is not a Colorado issue.

Well said. Just like it’s not a Washington issue. It’s a hunter issue.

 

[bayoublaster7527]

Rather than spend time on PAC's that tilt at windmills, if those two individuals would have voted with you, you'd have won on a split vote. So, if they're going to be coming back for the foreseable future, get to know them after the session, or when they come back to town. Be a valued source rather than just a pissed off voice they hear from once every session or so.

That’s good advice, thank you. I actually contacted both over a dozen times the past 3 weeks, phone calls and personal emails. Actually spoke to an aide/rep from each. I wouldn’t describe my tone as “pissed off” during those calls. They were open to listen. I also requested in person meetings but they refused. I will try again once session is over. I want to believe that a regular individual can be a “trusted source” but not making much headway. I wonder if folks who represent an org or from a board of an org get more time.

 

[perma]

That’s good advice, thank you. I actually contacted both over a dozen times the past 3 weeks, phone calls and personal emails. Actually spoke to an aide/rep from each. I wouldn’t describe my tone as “pissed off” during those calls. They were open to listen. I also requested in person meetings but they refused. I will try again once session is over. I want to believe that a regular individual can be a “trusted source” but not making much headway. I wonder if folks who represent an org or from a board of an org get more time.

I thought I heard folks from RMEF have an “in” sometimes if that makes sense.

 

[tormenter]

I hope they do and will start working on it. We need organized help, the anti's we are up are heavily funded and have stacks of lawyers intentional trying to drain CPW and the other state coffers if they don't get there way. We need help now. It would be difficult to change what has occurred, but we need to stop their movement and not stand by and watch it play out state by state, species by species.

We need help!

 

[perma]

I hope they do and will start working on it. We need organized help, the anti's we are up are heavily funded and have stacks of lawyers intentional trying to drain CPW and the other state coffers if they don't get there way. We need help now. It would be difficult to change what has occurred, but we need to stop their movement and not stand by and watch it play out state by state, species by species.

We need help!

Maybe it’s a question best answered by @Oak or someone smarter than me, but are hunting advocate groups such as RMEF, WSF and MDF in on this issue as well? I know HOWL is all over this.

 

[Browning55]

Maybe it’s a question best answered by @Oak or someone smarter than me, but are hunting advocate groups such as RMEF, WSF and MDF in on this issue as well? I know HOWL is all over this.

Yes. Rmef is a member of the cwcp, they are involved on many levels and are representing hunters in co within their mission and capability of a 501c(3). They have also been a partner and financial supporter of CRWM efforts.

In regards to the most recent vote, 1,490 rmef members took action last week and sent messages to their Senators about the commission confirmation vote. This was a direct action alert from rmef additive to howls campaign.

 

[Ben Lamb]

That’s good advice, thank you. I actually contacted both over a dozen times the past 3 weeks, phone calls and personal emails. Actually spoke to an aide/rep from each. I wouldn’t describe my tone as “pissed off” during those calls. They were open to listen. I also requested in person meetings but they refused. I will try again once session is over. I want to believe that a regular individual can be a “trusted source” but not making much headway. I wonder if folks who represent an org or from a board of an org get more time.

Staff will always try to keep you from meeting with a person. That's part of the purpose of their jobs, and during a session, free time for legislators is really tough. Regardless of what we think of legislators, they're working 15-20 hours a day during sessions.

The interim - the time between sessions - is when you can make and develop relationships. This is when legislators are home, or more available for coffee. Attend events they will be at, even fundraisers. You kind of have a captive audience then. They're desperate for your check, and you get to lean in a bit on them if they are expecting you to donate.

If you are going to try and find a path to a relationship, the best piece of advice I was ever given as a new lobbyist was to "start from where that person is": Meaning find out something about that person that provides common connections as well as have an understanding of that person's political philosophy beyond the partisan labels & standardized positions (what do they do for a living? family? What kind of passtimes do you share enjoyment of?). Be empathetic, polite, noncombative and courteous, even when they get to do the opposite.

And never, ever call them pig ****ers.

 

[Visiting Hunter]

Every state needs a group like howl, to help organize us all. Build these teams now. Then us as individuals need to set the ego down if we want any sort of continued opportunities for our children and their children... these radical issues are going to continue to pop up and probably get more and more creative along the way.. I thought it was interesting it only takes 5% population growth to change a western states voting... that really puts it into perspective for Montana these groups could really influence pretty easy out here if we don't get the right knowledge out to other social groups around the state that dont necessarily disagree or agree on it, and staying organized every year I hope everyone was good on defense because it's all we will ever be playing if we don't change the course a bit.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Every state needs a group like howl, to help organize us all. Build these teams now. Then us as individuals need to set the ego down if we want any sort of continued opportunities for our children and their children... these radical issues are going to continue to pop up and probably get more and more creative along the way.. I thought it was interesting it only takes 5% population growth to change a western states voting... that really puts it into perspective for Montana these groups could really influence pretty easy out here if we don't get the right knowledge out to other social groups around the state that dont necessarily disagree or agree on it, and staying organized every year I hope everyone was good on defense because it's all we will ever be playing if we don't change the course a bit.

Mass influx of emails and calls is a part of advocacy, but it's increasingly less important, especially if there is not someone in the halls of a capitol to direct fire & call it off (most importantly).

When HOWL did their thing in MT, this was the response from pro-hunting legislators: https://dailymontanan.com/2023/03/2...actics-related-to-hunting-trapping-amendment/

I appreciate that folks are trying to make it easier for citizens to participate in the process, but the reality is that if it isn't genuine and authentic, legislators will not be swayed.

We see this all the time in state houses, both red and blue. Personally, I've had legislators tell me that if "you don't call off the dogs now, this bill will pass." Legislatures aren't a free-for-all where mob tactics take the day. Volume of comments does not ever indicate the path of a bill or proposed regulation.

 

[TOGIE]

Personally, I've had legislators tell me that if "you don't call off the dogs now, this bill will pass." .

legislators promising to pass bills out of spite.

and you don't want us to call them pig ****ers?

 

[Visiting Hunter]

Mass influx of emails and calls is a part of advocacy, but it's increasingly less important, especially if there is not someone in the halls of a capitol to direct fire & call it off (most importantly).

When HOWL did their thing in MT, this was the response from pro-hunting legislators: https://dailymontanan.com/2023/03/2...actics-related-to-hunting-trapping-amendment/

I appreciate that folks are trying to make it easier for citizens to participate in the process, but the reality is that if it isn't genuine and authentic, legislators will not be swayed.

We see this all the time in state houses, both red and blue. Personally, I've had legislators tell me that if "you don't call off the dogs now, this bill will pass." Legislatures aren't a free-for-all where mob tactics take the day. Volume of comments does not ever indicate the path of a bill or proposed regulation.

My thinking was is if a organization could bring all the different users together.. hunting, trappers, fisherman, even down to the wild life photographers and stay at home moms or dads who just visit a state park every so often... just laying facts out of what the bills mean. And dive a bit deeper into what it would mean for recreation and all users of wildlife. My mother in law is fallen into the wolves stuff years ago... she thinks they all should be protected and we are horrible for wanting to harvest them doesnt take into consideration how well they do and what it would mean if populations were to high... and its because she saw some propaganda in the early 00s and wants to see a wolf in the wild, not just yellowstone... well she's almost 60 not in the best shape, and doesn't spend much time outdoors... she's gonna belive if she wants to see them they should be protected and her mind has been made up ever since. Her and my father in law have almost been divorced over this subject... but that peice of propaganda was enough to change her mind forever.... thats all I really mean we somehow need to be more organized as a group and articulating the facts and dismissing the propaganda to the large majority of people. But it does have to be done tasteful and tacticly.. my father in law is a purist and very smart like you... and lays facts out doesnt really let his opinion sway his decision but tbe facts... but it's not catchy and it's not a picture of a innocent wolf pup or lion cub... we all think they are cute too... but having the kids in Colorado name the wolves in school class is wild peice of propaganda... it's attaching feelings not facts to the kids and really playing the long game... I guess I dont really know how to combat it in a large scale... but I would think having a honest group that proves to be honest like rmef would stand a pretty good chance at laying out both sides arguments, and letting people decide what it actually means for them... vs all the propaganda... but propaganda is sexier unfortunately. Again I don't have the answer.

I do agree we need some people in the frontlines willing to hault these issues.. I guess I'm just kinda at a loss.. the differences we all have with eachother in the hunting community are going to be the fall... these guys don't care if we think the seasons should be a week longer or shorter, or if its a trophy hunt, tag allocations etc... they don't want a season at all at the end of the day... so if we don't figure a way out to combat that propaganda, I do think it will eventually win. Little by little... then agency's like California will be hiring trappers and sharpshooters to hunt the lions and wolves etc... the same problem but now the hunts are not on social media so the animal rights activist feel happy, not knowing how much more money was wasted in the pit of waste we already make. I definitely didn't realize what you pointed out though so thank you.

 

[Ben Lamb]

legislators promising to pass bills out of spite.

and you don't want us to call them pig ****ers?

Yep.

Actions have consequences.

And if you put yourself in their shoes - and you're getting a bunch of emails calling you names, or as even some posters have suggested - people are reaching out to your employers and harassing them - what the hell would you do?

Be polite, be kind and be authentic. It's not that difficult. Our mothers were supposed to teach us this and our daddies should have beat it into us.

 

[TOGIE]

Yep.

Actions have consequences.

And if you put yourself in their shoes - and you're getting a bunch of emails calling you names, or as even some posters have suggested - people are reaching out to your employers and harassing them - what the hell would you do?

Be polite, be kind and be authentic. It's not that difficult. Our mothers were supposed to teach us this and our daddies should have beat it into us.

no you were referring to mass e-mails simply advocating for a position. not mass e-mails harassing people and their family.

as far as what the hell would i do? i'd never be a politician, there is no amount of money - my soul is priceless.

so, i dunno