Bullet Fragmenting?

[flux]

I was on an outdoor range shooting Hornady Precision Hunter (308 178 gr ELD-X) out of a Tikka T3X Lite at 200 yards, paper target on a stand made of poster board and wood. I found what appears to be a bullet fragment stuck in the poster board, it made a hole in the paper much larger than a typical bullet hole. The shot didn’t feel noticeably different, I shot other rounds after that without issue. I wiped down the action when I got home and found two small pieces of metal, looked like filings/shavings from the bullet or casing.

Can someone help me understand what may have happened? I am planning on using this ammunition for elk hunting in a few weeks.

 

[Bigjav]

Looks like it may have had issues stabilizing that bullet, that would explain the larger hole. As for performance on game I’ve used them on a few muleys and they can/do fragment inside the animal because of the thin jacket towards the nose of the bullet

 

[rustednuts]

Looks like a tail low hit, from the bullet not spinning right

 

[Laelkhunter]

Do you have a muzzle brake on the rifle? If so, is it possible the bullet is striking the inside of the brake? If it does have a brake, remove the brake from the rifle and see if a bullet will easily go through the brake (just drop it in and see if it slides through without getting stuck). A chain saw file used lightly will remove any burrs on the interior of the brake. If you don't have a brake, I can't imagine what would cause the jacket fragments in the target. Maybe hitting the ground in front of the target, and bullet bouncing up and hitting the target.

 

[flux]

As for performance on game I’ve used them on a few muleys and they can/do fragment inside the animal because of the thin jacket towards the nose of the bullet

Does this make the shot less lethal?

Do you have a muzzle brake on the rifle?

There is no muzzle brake on this rifle.

 

[Brian in Montana]

Does this make the shot less lethal?



There is no muzzle brake on this rifle.

I concur with the observation that the bullet didn't stabilize for some reason. There could be a number of things to cause that. Under most circumstances I'd think a .308 shouldn't have much trouble stabilizing a 178gn bullet, and sounds like that one was an anomaly, so maybe it was just a defective round; doesn't happen often, but it's possible. If you have more do that, I'd assume there's a problem with the rifle - damaged muzzle crown maybe?

And fragmentation doesn't necessarily make a bullet less lethal, but most prefer a stouter bullet on a bulky, big-boned animal like elk. I would steer away from the ELD-X and SST for elk. If you like Hornady products, you might look at the Interbond, but I think they only sell that as a component. Really the standard Interlock bullet is pretty tough and I've shot a couple elk with it. There is a contingent that considers the Interlock to be very under-rated.

 

[flux]

And fragmentation doesn't necessarily make a bullet less lethal, but most prefer a stouter bullet on a bulky, big-boned animal like elk. I would steer away from the ELD-X and SST for elk. If you like Hornady products, you might look at the Interbond, but I think they only sell that as a component. Really the standard Interlock bullet is pretty tough and I've shot a couple elk with it. There is a contingent that considers the Interlock to be very under-rated.

I sure do have a lot to learn. I only chose this ammunition because I have been struggling to find any other “high quality” hunting ammunition locally.

This weekend will be my last opportunity before the hunt to zero in my optic with different ammunition. As an inexperienced shooter, I don’t plan on taking any shot past 150 yards this season. I have one box of Hornady Superformance 165 gr GMX and one box of Federal Premium 175gr Terminal Ascent. Would either of these be a better option?

Thank you for taking the time to read and comment, I appreciate everyone's insight.

 

[Don Fischer]

I used a 308 for a lot of years but never on an elk. My bullet all those years was started as a 165gr Hornady Spire Point and then to the interlock. Never had a problem with either. Have killed two elk with my 6,5x06 and 140gr Hornady interlock, one shot and down never recovered either bullet. Have killed three with my 30-06 and 180gr Interlock and again one shot and down, not problem and didn't recover any bullet.

That bullet in your photo does appear to have tumbled through the target. Why? Not a clue, maybe just a bad bullet. Every manufacturer of any product has an ah suds now and then. I think the TTSX or TSX without the plastic tip will have a tenacity to close the tip. I say that because I've seen other HP bullet's do it then when I fired to see what they would do into a stack of news paper. When Winchester started using monolithic bullet's they had plastic tip's and they said it was to help initiate expansion. Other than closing the tip and losing a petal now and then, have never heard of a copper bullet failing to do what it was designed to do. Pretty expensive bullet's though.

If you want to use a bullet that heavy I'd suggest giving a 180gr bullet a try. I did in my old 308 and and they shot as well as the 165gr bullet. I did load up some 200gr bullet's in that 308 and we carried that rifle along fishing in Alaska. They were not as accurate as the 165 and 180gr bullet's but out to 100+ yds they were more than accurate enough considering I didn't plan on shooting anything at anywhere near that range.

If you really like that bullet, shoot it some more looking for it to do that again, probably won't but ya never know!

 

[Brian in Montana]

I sure do have a lot to learn. I only chose this ammunition because I have been struggling to find any other “high quality” hunting ammunition locally.

This weekend will be my last opportunity before the hunt to zero in my optic with different ammunition. As an inexperienced shooter, I don’t plan on taking any shot past 150 yards this season. I have one box of Hornady Superformance 165 gr GMX and one box of Federal Premium 175gr Terminal Ascent. Would either of these be a better option?

Thank you for taking the time to read and comment, I appreciate everyone's insight.

I've never used either, but those are both hardy bullets, probably a little better option on elk if you're gun will shoot them accurately. The GMX is a monolithic bullet, it's made of a guilding metal, a solid copper-zink alloy without a lead core. The only trouble you might have with is it might not expand great at lower velocity. It's a very hard bullet. Id think if you keep your shots under 200yds, it would do great.

I'm not too familiar with the Terminal Ascent, but I'm a big fan of its cousin, the Federal Trophy Bonded Tip. Real all-around good bullet.

If you you want to grab some simpler, less expensive stuff, I'd suggest 165 grain Hornady Custom. That uses a boattail version of the Interlock or BTSP (boat tail spire point). My .308s have always shot that ammo well and there is no elk I wouldn't shoot with it, within a reasonable distance.

 

[brockel]

308 velocities are easy on bullets. Pick a bullet that is accurate in your gun and go kill an elk. Despite what you read they aren’t armor clad

 

[devon deer]

I was on an outdoor range shooting Hornady Precision Hunter (308 178 gr ELD-X) out of a Tikka T3X Lite at 200 yards, paper target on a stand made of poster board and wood. I found what appears to be a bullet fragment stuck in the poster board, it made a hole in the paper much larger than a typical bullet hole. The shot didn’t feel noticeably different, I shot other rounds after that without issue. I wiped down the action when I got home and found two small pieces of metal, looked like filings/shavings from the bullet or casing.

Can someone help me understand what may have happened? I am planning on using this ammunition for elk hunting in a few weeks.

View attachment 155670View attachment 155671View attachment 155672

You need to read this mate, ditch those ELD-X and buy some soft point bullets.

Never Seen Damage Like This - Warning *Graphic*

Shot my sheep at 160-180 yards broadside with a 162 grain Hornady ELD-X 7mm. This photo is the entry side, and the bullet entered right above the "elbow joint" right where I was aiming. It exited on the offside high in the rear ribs as the shot angle was pretty steep above us. I have never...

www.hunttalk.com

Cheers
Richard

 

[Don Fischer]

You need to read this mate, ditch those ELD-X and buy some soft point bullets.

Never Seen Damage Like This - Warning *Graphic*

Shot my sheep at 160-180 yards broadside with a 162 grain Hornady ELD-X 7mm. This photo is the entry side, and the bullet entered right above the "elbow joint" right where I was aiming. It exited on the offside high in the rear ribs as the shot angle was pretty steep above us. I have never...

www.hunttalk.com

Cheers
Richard

I have used soft point bullet's all my life and the only failure I ever had was when I chose a bad bullet for the cartridge I was shooting. Mostly ll those years I used Hornady spire point/intrlock bullet's but also some Speer Hot core's. With the right bullet I would use either on anything in North America. Those plastic tip bullet's except in monolithic bullet's to me are for varmint's. That tip has to go somewhere and when it hits something it slams right back into the bullet core. Has to get ugly. Will they kill? Of course, so will an FMJ! In monolithic bullet's they help start expansion. Shot some Sierra HP bullet's into pile of news paper years ago and the HP closed up and bullet bent! have read where the same thing has happened with monolithic bullet's without the tip. Something about the tip on cup and core bullet's, in varmint bullet's they are to create rapid expansion and what I've seen using 75 gr V-Max out f a 243, they do really blow up with little resistance. In hunting bullet's they seem to be designed to increase BC so the bullet will fly somewhat flatter at long range and start expansion at much lower velocity. When I started hand loading in the late 60's we were cautioned to pick bullet's carefully. Seem's today people want a bullet they don't have to worry about no matter what. If that's you I'd think the way to go is monolithic, the FMJ type bullet that expands! But I have shot a few animals, predictor's with FMJ's and hit a bone and the bullet will hang together but the damage increase's greatly. Just imagine a cup and core hitting something at high velocity with a tip that get's driven back into the bullet. I don't shoot premium bullet's but if I did they would likely be monolithic bullet's for no other reason than the design. My experience with the old Speer Hot Core would tempt me to bonded bullet's but not with that plastic tip. That might be way off course but I know what 50 yrs of reloading and hunting has taught me. No company makes a bullet proof bullet to suit all occasions possibly excepting monolithic bullet's. Choose your bullet's with care!

 

[MTLabrador]

I have used soft point bullet's all my life and the only failure I ever had was when I chose a bad bullet for the cartridge I was shooting. Mostly ll those years I used Hornady spire point/intrlock bullet's but also some Speer Hot core's. With the right bullet I would use either on anything in North America. Those plastic tip bullet's except in monolithic bullet's to me are for varmint's. That tip has to go somewhere and when it hits something it slams right back into the bullet core. Has to get ugly. Will they kill? Of course, so will an FMJ! In monolithic bullet's they help start expansion. Shot some Sierra HP bullet's into pile of news paper years ago and the HP closed up and bullet bent! have read where the same thing has happened with monolithic bullet's without the tip. Something about the tip on cup and core bullet's, in varmint bullet's they are to create rapid expansion and what I've seen using 75 gr V-Max out f a 243, they do really blow up with little resistance. In hunting bullet's they seem to be designed to increase BC so the bullet will fly somewhat flatter at long range and start expansion at much lower velocity. When I started hand loading in the late 60's we were cautioned to pick bullet's casefully. Seem's today people want a bullet they don't have to worry about no matter what. If that's you I'd think the way to go is monolithic, the FMJ type bullet that expands! But I have shot a few animals, preditaor's with FNJ's and hit a bone and the bullet will hang together but the damage increase's greatly. Just imagine a cup and core hitting something at high velocity with a tip that get's driven back into the bullet. I don't shoot premium bullet's but if I did they would likely be monolithic bullet's for no other reason than the design. My experience with the old Speer Hot Core would tempt me to bonded bullet's but not with that plastic tip. That might be way off course but I know what 50 yrs of reloading and hunting has taught me. No company makes a bullet proof bullet to suit all occasions possibly excepting monolithic bullet's. Choose your bullet's with care!

A V-max is a varmint bullet that’s designed to be explosive. Plenty of tough, tipped bullets out there (Accubond, TTSX, Ballistic Tip, Scirocco).

 

[Fire_9]

I’ve read reports of the ELDs coming apart mid flight. I have a hard time believing it would happen in a .308 but it could happen. Do a little looking on snipers hide and accurate shooter and you’ll find reports of it happening

 

[Taxed in Maine]

I personally detest ELD bullets for anything but target practice.
If they shoot ok in your rifle, I would shoot the GMX.

 

[track1]

I killed my mountain goat with 145gr eldx from a 270 WSM. 2 shots at 275 yards. Both good hits. Recovered both bullets. Going back to accubonds. Won’t trust the ELDX on an elk, especially a shoulder hit. The Eldx are accurate though.