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tjones
Guest
Interesting reading.
npaden
Well-known member
Interesting that in the East Fort Area the biggest mortality losses were due to the dreaded unknown.
Also only 1 loss to wolves seems surprising. Have the wolves moved out of the Bitterroot to bigger and better things?
Also, 64% recruitment rate on the known calves seems pretty good to me.
Also only 1 loss to wolves seems surprising. Have the wolves moved out of the Bitterroot to bigger and better things?
Also, 64% recruitment rate on the known calves seems pretty good to me.
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tjones
Guest
Some of the unknown could be wolves. The transmitters go on mortality then the reseachers go to the transmitter asap. On the unknowns there usually nothing left except the ear tag. Could be a lot of things, but no smoking gun.
If calves would quit dieing we would be in good shape.
If calves would quit dieing we would be in good shape.
Dinkshooter
Well-known member
Whats up with the crackhead cow that left here calf? Maybe Meth instead of Crack?
I thought wolves were the problem. HA
I thought wolves were the problem. HA
Horn Seeker
New member
The wolves definitely have not left the Root! A guy can wish though.
belly-deep
Active member
- Joined
- Oct 31, 2009
- Messages
- 3,459
What this study doesn't show is how many elk are killed indirectly by wolves. I don't think continual running of game herds is good for them in the winter, but animals that use all of their energy and winterkill will never be accounted for in these studies.
jryoung
Well-known member
The study is specifically focused on calf survival/mortality. I would like to see another study focusing on winter mortality. Conditions may be more difficult to work in, but with elk concentrations high due to limited range it may be manageable.
Then take the data from the two studies combined with hunter harvest and you'd have a pretty complete picture of the predation risks for elk.
Then take the data from the two studies combined with hunter harvest and you'd have a pretty complete picture of the predation risks for elk.
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tjones
Guest
They are collaring cows. GPS collars. They drop once a year, the data is down loaded then another approx 70 cows are collared again. They have done 2 groups, third and final will come this winter.
The collared cows lead them to the calves in the spring that then get ear tagged. All cow morts are also checked out
The collared cows lead them to the calves in the spring that then get ear tagged. All cow morts are also checked out
RockyDog
Member
is there any evidence to suggest that unknowns may be wolf kills? that would be interesting to know considering the intro to this study always highlights the lions yet the unknowns kills almost as many as the lions. know what i mean?
jryoung
Well-known member
I think at a minimum you'd have average the known kills and apply it to the unknowns. I'd be curious to know what evidence there was for the unknowns to make an educated guess.
bjtc_brian
Member
I didn't read the study, but is there anything in the study about cows that don't have calves tagged? Meaning they were dry or something killed them before they could tag them. I think the wolves get a lot of calves before they are a couple of days old.
Having collared a fair number of calves in Idaho my experience is that bears (both black and grizzlies) are the top source of calf mortality early in a calves life. The stuff I helped on pretty much showed that if a calf could get through the first month of hiding from bears it was almost home free until fall and winter came. The conservative lion harvest in this study area really seems to coorelate to calf mortality. Really looking forward to seeing more results from the next year of the project.
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tjones
Guest
I have this data from last winter/spring I will try and find it. In between hunts.
Tone is spot on.
bjtc_brian
Member
I agree totally, that bears don't get enough credit for depredation on calves. And lions don't get enough credit for depredation at all. My thought was just that with the way wolves keep track of the elk heards, it would be hard to believe they wouldn't smell the fresh birth signs and have some easy dinner.
Also, with as much as bears scavange, how can they be sure the kill was the bear and not say a lion?
We acutally watched wolves and elk in the same meadows on multiple occasions where they couldn't have cared less about each other, surprising for sure. I'm not sure we had a single calf killed by a wolf in the first few months of life.
As for cause of death, we were typically getting to dead calves within hours of them dying. Lots of clues as to cause including presense of predator tracks, predator scats, condition of the carcass, whether it was buried or not, tooth marks on the carcass, location of carcass/habitat, etc. If you get there fast cause of death can be pretty easy.
As for cause of death, we were typically getting to dead calves within hours of them dying. Lots of clues as to cause including presense of predator tracks, predator scats, condition of the carcass, whether it was buried or not, tooth marks on the carcass, location of carcass/habitat, etc. If you get there fast cause of death can be pretty easy.
