Bitcoin - Cryptocurrency

[westbranch]

Regulation is coming. I agree that some of the more popular ones might survive and thrive. Not sure about the thrive part. It seems like only two things are driving the buyers - speculation and the need to conceal the transaction. The later will get hit hard because, at the very least, the government likes to collects its taxes.

The IRS sent out letters to 10,000 taxpayers in 2019, pretty much no way to hide transactions with a US based "wallet" like Coinbase.

Court grants IRS summons of Coinbase records

The Service's narrowed request seeking unreported virtual currency transactions was made in 'good faith.'

www.journalofaccountancy.com

IRS has begun sending letters to virtual currency owners advising them to pay back taxes, file amended returns; part of agency's larger efforts | Internal Revenue Service

IR-2019-132, July 26, 2019 — The IRS has begun sending letters to taxpayers with virtual currency transactions that potentially failed to report income and pay the resulting tax from virtual currency transactions or did not report their transactions properly.

www.irs.gov

Everybody buying should be sure they are answering all of the questions on their 2020 (and 2019 tax return, and possibly look back at their records for the last few years.

 

[SAJ-99]

i could see some serious regulation on crypto potentially doing one of two things: creating a legit space for crypto to flourish or kill it dead where it's standing

we'll see. i can't help but see someone who is just yelling at the damn kids on her lawn though

I should probably also add there is a defense concern as well, which is my main concern, surrounds the decentralized nature of crypto. While proponents like the idea of anonymity in ownership and decentralization, very Libertarian and all, it has a serious problem. The bitcoin "mining" requires huge amount of power. A country (China) could give provide cheap/free electricity and even free computer programmers to mine bitcoin and we wouldn't know it. At some point, China could just flood the market with Bitcoin and collapse its value. Think Germany printing counterfeit US Dollars in WWII to try to collapse the US economy by causing people to lose faith in our currency. No different really.

 

[BigHornRam]

Better they mine that crap in China. They won't be mining it in my backyard.

Missoula County revisits zoning for cryptocurrency mining

The Missoula County Planning Board held its first public hearing on a proposal for the permanent zoning of cryptocurrency mining operations.

www.kpax.com

 

[TOGIE]

I should probably also add there is a defense concern as well, which is my main concern, surrounds the decentralized nature of crypto. While proponents like the idea of anonymity in ownership and decentralization, very Libertarian and all, it has a serious problem. The bitcoin "mining" requires huge amount of power. A country (China) could give provide cheap/free electricity and even free computer programmers to mine bitcoin and we wouldn't know it. At some point, China could just flood the market with Bitcoin and collapse its value. Think Germany printing counterfeit US Dollars in WWII to try to collapse the US economy by causing people to lose faith in our currency. No different really.

this would be true of ethereum but not bitcoin. bitcoins coding stipulates a fixed supply of 21 million coins

 

[MO Betta]

The bitcoin "mining" requires huge amount of power. A country (China) give provide cheap/free electricity and even free computer programmers to mine bitcoin and we wouldn't know it. At some point, China could just flood the market with Bitcoin and collapse its value. Think Germany printing counterfeit US Dollars in WWII to try to collapse the US economy by causing people to lose faith in our currency. No different really.

There are literal warehouses in various countries like China with vast arrays of servers "farming" coin. China's mining pools control over 60% of the bitcoin network's total hashrate, which is actually less than they used to. Cheap power is the number one factor in establishing mining pools/CoLos, like you said - and energy costs are often subsidized by the government there. Another factor is their share of the manufacturing of hardware used for mining. They've also been cracking down on and sometimes seizing assets from operators in their country.

 

[TOGIE]

I should probably also add there is a defense concern as well, which is my main concern, surrounds the decentralized nature of crypto. While proponents like the idea of anonymity in ownership and decentralization, very Libertarian and all, it has a serious problem. The bitcoin "mining" requires huge amount of power. A country (China) could give provide cheap/free electricity and even free computer programmers to mine bitcoin and we wouldn't know it. At some point, China could just flood the market with Bitcoin and collapse its value. Think Germany printing counterfeit US Dollars in WWII to try to collapse the US economy by causing people to lose faith in our currency. No different really.

that said (what i already said, that is) i do kinda want to explore this concept. theoretically let's say that china does do an ethereum mining campaign in an effort to destroy the US economy - for that to work wouldn't it rely upon the assumption that ethereum has become the US currency? or a significant portion of the US currency upon which we've collectively agreed to rely upon?

they can sell their eth and in doing so convert it to yuans, or USD, right? but they can't just effectively create USD out of thin air from crypto that would deflate our currency and economy. a seller always requires a buyer right? am i missing something?

 

[SAJ-99]

that said (what i already said, that is) i do kinda want to explore this concept. theoretically let's say that china does do an ethereum mining campaign in an effort to destroy the US economy - for that to work wouldn't it rely upon the assumption that ethereum has become the US currency? or a significant portion of the US currency upon which we've collectively agreed to rely upon?

they can sell their eth and in doing so convert it to yuans, or USD, right? but they can't just effectively create USD out of thin air from crypto that would deflate our currency and economy. a seller always requires a buyer right? am i missing something?

First paragraph- Yes, but I'm not sure at what point something is "significant". But isn't your point of owning the crypto because it will become "significant"? If at some point in the future 10% of all transactions happen in some form of crypto, that is a LOT of money in a $25T economy, not even counting foreign transactions in USD$.

Second para- But they do effectively created BTC (debatable you say) or ETH out of thin air by mining it. There was talk of them buying BTC back in the $7000 level. The fact that the asset is untraceable makes it a problem. Stocks and bonds are all registered. We know "exactly" how many USTreasuries China holds- We even can get a pretty good estimate through the global banking system on how much USD cash any country holds. We have no idea how much crypto anyone holds, which is why I suspect that eventually it gets registered through regulation. What you have to remember is that China (like the US Federal Reserve) doesn't care if it loses money on any transaction. They buy and sell for strategic purposes. Yes, you need a buyer and seller, but if BTC gets to your goal of being popular, you are not buying or selling BTC in exchange for USD, you are buying and selling in exchange for goods and services. Any holder of a huge block of that currency (China) could collapse its value buy selling it. BTC is priced in USD, so they could collapse the price of BTC in USD and then covert the USD to CNY. Currency markets are the most liquid in the world. Trillions in value exchange every day. It is hard (but not impossible) to change market values. But if you get out in front of a new currency (BTC, ETH) that is untraceable and own enough you could build significant power.

 

[Flatrock]

50%? This pos is getting ready to be a pile in the basement elevator shaft.

Haha. Just like Tesla.

 

[Irrelevant]

Haha. Just like Tesla.

You beat me to it

 

[pointingdogsrule]

Hey, he never stated when it would happen.

Haha. Just like Tesla.

 

[Flatrock]

So now Tesla is buying bitcoin... @BigHornRam You must just be loving that!!! Haha.

Sure wouldn't mind if bitcoin would have one of its 80-90% corrections that is has historically had.

 

[BigHornRam]

So now Tesla is buying bitcoin... @BigHornRam You must just be loving that!!! Haha.

Sure wouldn't mind if bitcoin would have one of its 80-90% corrections that is has historically had.

Further evidence the guy is a flaming nut job.

 

[Flatrock]

Further evidence the guy is a flaming nut job.

Interesting way to describe the richest guy on the planet.

 

[Irrelevant]

Interesting way to describe the richest guy on the planet.

I believe former...

 

[Trial153]

Loving me some bitcoin of late, early march for me to hit the one year mark.

 

[BigHornRam]

Interesting way to describe the richest guy on the planet.

Howard Hughes was once the richest guy and was also a flaming nut job.

 

[westbranch]

When it hits $30k I am buying $100.

So I stuck to my word, the lowest I saw bitcoin go that week was 30,500. So I did not buy any.

 

[Irrelevant]

So I stuck to my word, the lowest I saw bitcoin go that week was 30,500. So I did not buy any.

I had the same limit. I debated it several times at 31 though

 

[Flatrock]

Howard Hughes was once the richest guy and was also a flaming nut job.

Haters gonna hate.

Interesting article here... Tesla May Have Already Made More In Profits From Bitcoin Than Electric Vehicles (yahoo.com)

 

[Flatrock]

So I stuck to my word, the lowest I saw bitcoin go that week was 30,500. So I did not buy any.

Wouldn't be surprised if you still get a chance under 30k this year... Hell maybe under 20k.