Sheltowee
Well-known member
What power was your scope. Heard that a 40x zoom is required.
Be prepare before hire a Guide/Outfitter!
- Thread starter hunter72
- Start date
Misguided
Well-known member
Horses are a pain
Elk move
Elk hunting is hard
Is what it is
Elk move
Elk hunting is hard
Is what it is
np307
Well-known member
This is why that other guy was scoping horses
np307
Well-known member
Seriously though, that sounds like a terrible hunt. And one that a lot more upfront communication might have been able to prevent. I'm guessing with that sketchy of an outfit, you probably didn't get a ton of great info beforehand.
Joseph Peterson
Active member
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2013
- Messages
- 58
Hey, I guided that guy! Once.
LopeHunter
Well-known member
Horses are by design not safe to be on even on soft, flat land. I have been thrown, bailed as a saddle rotated then my finger got caught in the leather reins which dislocated and fractured it, bailed as a horse began sliding as topped a snow-covered ridge and stepped onto wind-swept ice-covered rock which then stomped onto my left knee and had a horse collapse twice onto its front knees in a 30-minute span. I have used horses on three hunts over 3 decades of big game hunting. They are dangerous but can get you and lots of food and gear a long way from the crowds in a few wilderness units and get any meat out in one trip if you tip over a critter.
I seek references whether is hunting, a contractor or a services agreement. With social media and the internet, can do more than rely on references provided to you. I went to Africa recently and before signed the contract I found a lot of info without relying on the references I was given. No guarantee re quality of the adventure but was a great track record spanning over 20 years.
Someone mentioned elk hunting is a crapshoot if relying on elk to follow a pattern on public land based on prior years for the same time you are hunting this year. Private land can be great year after year if is a sanctuary in an area where the public land gets hammered. Last I checked, 20% of bull elk tags in Western states end up in a harvest. I would venture that 15 of the hunters which harvest out of the 100 hunters with tags are by a few hunters which rarely eat tag soup on elk hunts, 5 of the hunters that harvest out of 100 are shooting their first elk or are rarely successful and 80 of 100 are the rest of hunters that have the odds stacked against them due to never having hunted elk or never hunted that region for elk or they like to stay on a road glassing from a heated truck or they give it a few hours a day for a day or two each season or are smoking as hunt or the altitude kicks there rear or are sitting on the 4-wheeler with the motor running while glassing for 5 minutes then zooming off to the next spot, etc.
Being guided improves your odds of filling a bull elk tag though are a lot of guided hunters on public land each year not notching a tag. Maybe they never see a legal bull, maybe pass up a legal bull as want something bigger or are lousy marksman. Having a shot opportunity on a legal animal is how most guides describe past success of hunters they have guided. If your son had a shot on a legal animal then he is on the plus side of the guide's honest description of his services.
I would have not gotten on the same horse that train-wrecked me on the way in as was heading back out. The guide would be riding that horse out or have it packing gear. I do know some guides with horses have weight limits on the hunter so not sure if that came into play. I have seen 190 and 200 pounds as upper weight limit for the rider.
Good luck as head back into the woods. I think long and hard re horses and think I would need to draw a bighorn sheep tag to mount up again in the steep stuff.
I seek references whether is hunting, a contractor or a services agreement. With social media and the internet, can do more than rely on references provided to you. I went to Africa recently and before signed the contract I found a lot of info without relying on the references I was given. No guarantee re quality of the adventure but was a great track record spanning over 20 years.
Someone mentioned elk hunting is a crapshoot if relying on elk to follow a pattern on public land based on prior years for the same time you are hunting this year. Private land can be great year after year if is a sanctuary in an area where the public land gets hammered. Last I checked, 20% of bull elk tags in Western states end up in a harvest. I would venture that 15 of the hunters which harvest out of the 100 hunters with tags are by a few hunters which rarely eat tag soup on elk hunts, 5 of the hunters that harvest out of 100 are shooting their first elk or are rarely successful and 80 of 100 are the rest of hunters that have the odds stacked against them due to never having hunted elk or never hunted that region for elk or they like to stay on a road glassing from a heated truck or they give it a few hours a day for a day or two each season or are smoking as hunt or the altitude kicks there rear or are sitting on the 4-wheeler with the motor running while glassing for 5 minutes then zooming off to the next spot, etc.
Being guided improves your odds of filling a bull elk tag though are a lot of guided hunters on public land each year not notching a tag. Maybe they never see a legal bull, maybe pass up a legal bull as want something bigger or are lousy marksman. Having a shot opportunity on a legal animal is how most guides describe past success of hunters they have guided. If your son had a shot on a legal animal then he is on the plus side of the guide's honest description of his services.
I would have not gotten on the same horse that train-wrecked me on the way in as was heading back out. The guide would be riding that horse out or have it packing gear. I do know some guides with horses have weight limits on the hunter so not sure if that came into play. I have seen 190 and 200 pounds as upper weight limit for the rider.
Good luck as head back into the woods. I think long and hard re horses and think I would need to draw a bighorn sheep tag to mount up again in the steep stuff.
A Guide/Outfitter but no longer.
I hired for just a drop because they don't kill a lot but know the country very well from folks I spoke with.
After my research where I wanted to go and hearing you need to find someone who knows the country as I did then the rest was on us.
There horses were not ready for such a haul in 14 miles was the biggest issue. when a horse falls asleep 3 times standing there and falls completely to the ground the poor horse needs a workout prior to a 14-mile haul in. Then telling us we were too heavy for the horses, and we were in better shape than they were.
In my opinion simply a Joke first time and never again. If I can't do it and kill what I'm after I don't need someone to lead me by the hand. Been doing this way to long.
we were supposed to get dropped at a specific location
after the fall and the time, it took to get me up and able to sit the horse again the indication was it was to far to the drop site. We are going to drop you on prior creek.
I said no we are going to chicken coop, and they just rode up prior and said here is where you are.
I said how far to the next water, only creek within 4-5 miles.
Oh, don't think If I had not been hurting more would have been done at that point.
We had a guide/outfitter and a hand ride in the day before we got out and could not be leave that we were dropped right there as he had hunters coming in the second hunt and was hoping there were animals using the creek. LOL when he saw our camp he asked what the hell you are camping on the creek for LOL the son explained what happened.
The outfitter said they should be shot and know better than this.
Then after the son gave him a 5 day report he asked the son you been here before it sounds like no first time the son said. He spoke up said Well son you know more than most that have been in here.
They went on to say no outfitter should ever drop a hunter right on a creek in this country but aways away from it to if they need some water. we also packed in 30gals of water and dropped on water.
Now is that stupid or what.
That is a good statement.
First, I did not want on the same horse but again was told that is the horse you're riding out on.
At this point I was not in any frame of mind to argue as I just wanted the hell off that creek.
The kid and I both were right at 240 not an ounce of fat in good shape never asked about weight until the fall then said we were both 2 heavies for her horses.
These horses were not used prior but for trail rides and not at all on a long 14-mile ride into the wilderness of 16B.
An outfitter and his wrangler rode in the day before our ride out. said those horses should have been on those workouts weeks before the ride in and were not.
That is on the outfitter big time. no one can be that stupid. @ riders 240 and all their gear for 2 weeks plus 30 gals of water and 3 mules and 4 horses.
That outfitter needs some schooling according to these 2 outfitters who have been going in 16B for 16 years.
They even offered to haul us out and would have to get their pack train, but we'd have to be there any extra day, and I was not ready for that.
Makes you feel halfway good when chatting with ppl who know what they're talking about.
There are a lot of A--holes on this site that think it's all a joke and fun and games to go through and deal with this kind of Sh--.
For those as-holes I wish they had to go through it once to see their damn reaction. it's always the BLOWHARDS with the most to say.
yea you are one of the BLOWHARDS many speak about. Its a wonder being from Nevada
I don't think anyone on here is making fun of your circumstance...we're just having a hard time deciphering your story.
LousyResident
Well-known member
- Joined
- Sep 19, 2016
- Messages
- 3,122
Are you going to name the service or not? Otherwise, this doesn't help any of us at all.
2rocky
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jul 23, 2010
- Messages
- 5,157
Khunter
Well-known member
@hunter72
You talk a retired outfitter in the coming out of retirement, even paid for outfitter or guide license so they could do it legally, and then you somehow thought they were gonna have a bunch of perfectly trained and conditioned for long distance horses ready to roll.
But I didn’t happen. That should not be a surprise.
Not sure why you would not have gone with an active Hunting outfitter instead of a retired sight seeing trip outfitter. The website mentions nothing about expertise outfitting hunters
Your son did draw a potentially great elk hunting tag. If you really were trying to help him you could have put $$ up for an actual hunting outfit instead of a cut rate sightseeing horse packer and short of doing that the very best thing you could’ve done was ride back out on that horse the day you got your concussion so he could’ve spent his two weeks hunting instead of just one week and probably worried to death about you and you’re very symptomatic head injury the whole time.
The number one thing Docs seem to tell people like you and me who are on blood thinners is to go to hospital right away if you hit your head. Period.
You talk a retired outfitter in the coming out of retirement, even paid for outfitter or guide license so they could do it legally, and then you somehow thought they were gonna have a bunch of perfectly trained and conditioned for long distance horses ready to roll.
But I didn’t happen. That should not be a surprise.
Not sure why you would not have gone with an active Hunting outfitter instead of a retired sight seeing trip outfitter. The website mentions nothing about expertise outfitting hunters
Your son did draw a potentially great elk hunting tag. If you really were trying to help him you could have put $$ up for an actual hunting outfit instead of a cut rate sightseeing horse packer and short of doing that the very best thing you could’ve done was ride back out on that horse the day you got your concussion so he could’ve spent his two weeks hunting instead of just one week and probably worried to death about you and you’re very symptomatic head injury the whole time.
The number one thing Docs seem to tell people like you and me who are on blood thinners is to go to hospital right away if you hit your head. Period.
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