Barnes Triple Shock bullets

[Washington Hunter]

Has anybody tried the new triple shocks? I've got a box of the 140 grain in 270. I'm planning on loading them up with H4350 and shooting them through a chronograph this weekend. All I've ever loaded for my 270 is 150 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips with 58 grains of H4831. Last weekend I loaded 5 with 52.0 grains of H4350 and 5 with 52.5 H4350, using the 150 Ballistic Tip. I also shot a 5 shot group with my standard load of 58 grains H4831. The H4831 gave an average velocity of 2918, and the 52.5 of H4350 gave 2888, only 30 fps less. All groups were good, right at 1 inch. What I'm wondering is should I use similar charges of powder with the 140 grain Triple Shock? I'm out of H4831 at the moment, so I'm only trying the H4350 for now. If I get lucky and end up with a good group, I'll probably just continue using the H4350. Just curious about any experience anybody here may have with reloading with the Triple Shocks. Any thoughts greatly appreciated.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 02-03-2004 23:14: Message edited by: Washington Hunter ]</font>

 

[Bambistew]

I havn't tried them yet but have talked to a few that have. Since barnes pushed the tripple shocks before they had printed the load data for them they said to use the data for the regular "X" bullet. You should get a little more velocity than the regular X with the same load but not much.

Good luck
Ivan

 

[BHR]

W. H.,

Max load for 140 gr X bullet is 54 gr H4350 with a velocity of 3028 fps. Recommended powders for this bullet are H414, IMR4350, and IMR4831. All come in around the same velocity as the H4350.

I have not tried the Triple Shock bullets yet, but am a big fan of the XLC's. You should try the 130 gr XLC's some time. Published velocities are in the 3200 fps range and H4831 is one of the recommended powders. I would much rather use a 130 gr Barnse bullet on an elk, than a 150 gr ballistic tip. Good luck with your project!

Paul

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 02-04-2004 08:07: Message edited by: BHR ]</font>

 

[Gunner46]

I've only shot Barnes bullets once, and claim to be NO authority on reloading them, but I do know this. Because they contain no lead, for their weight, they have a longer structural surface than a similar weight bullet containing lead. What this means is increased friction, during the barrel travel, and all other being factors equal, increased chamber pressures.

To stay on the safe side I personally would look at the load data for the next bullet weight UP, from the one you plan on using, and start with those powder charges. If your going to use 140's, I'd load 150 data.

No, your not going to equal the volicity usually published for the 140's. With barnes bullets don't try. The terminal effect, on game, is what your seeking. Their design will provide that.

The Triple Shock's look like they were adopted from some earlier experiments, by other bullet makers, who cut shallow rings into the surface to reduce the surface drag.

I'd still want to play it on the safe side of this one and work up, carefully. Who Knows, They may be a winner! But getting blown up in the process of learning isn't my idea a fun day at the range!!

 

[Washington Hunter]

Thanks for the help guys. I think I will start at 52 grains H4350 and work up to 54. Paul did you get your figures from the Barnes manual and is that data for the standard X bullet? I have used the standard X bullets but it's been over 10 years ago, and it was in my 264 Win. Mag. I wasn't real happy with their performance, accuracy was good, although it took a while of playing around with seating depth of the bullet to get a decent group, but their performance on game wasn't very impressive. I shot a bull elk at about 40 yards, broadside, two shots through both lungs, and he was still standing, so I put a third bullet through both shoulders. That put him down immediately, but the exit wounds from the first two shots were no bigger than the entrance wounds, and the third bullet I recovered just inside the hide of the far shoulder...it didn't expand even the slightest bit. The point was bent just barely, other than that it was like an unfired bullet, and after going through both shoulders at well over 3000 feet per second, that was hard to believe. Anyway I'm hoping these triple shocks will expand more reliably, and hopefully won't be quite as finicky as far as accuracy goes.

 

[BHR]

W. H.,

Data came from #3 Barnes manual. Sorry to hear about your experience 10 years ago. I think the X bullet has improved since then. I've only been reloading and shooting Barnes bullets for 2 years, so my experience is limited. I've recovered some bullets shot into stumps and everyone is text book expansion. And they weigh the same as before they were fired. Keep us posted on how the Triple Shock bullets work out.

Paul

 

[dgibson]

WH, there's a pretty thorough review here:

Part 1

Part 2

His bottom line is that they're good, but the XLC's are pretty much just as good for less money.

 

[Washington Hunter]

Darren, thanks for the articles. The XLC is actually the most expenive of the three, but for me cost is not the object. I wanted to try the Triple Shock as I heard it is or can be more accurate than the standard X bullet or the XLC. From the articles, there was only 32 feet per second difference between the slowest bullet (standard X) and the fastest (XLC). So velocity really isn't a significant factor in deciding which bullet to use. I will be happy if I can push that 140 grain bullet to 3000 fps, and get groups of 2 inches or less at 200 yards.

Paul, are you using that 130 grain XLC in a 270 Win? If so, how has accuracy been?

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 02-05-2004 21:58: Message edited by: Washington Hunter ]</font>

 

[BHR]

Darren,

Thanks for the informative links.

W. H.,

I have been using 140 gr. XLC's in my 7-08 mountain rifle. I'm loading 51.5 grs of H380, and getting about 2950 fps out of a 20 inch barrel, and 1 inch 3 shot groups. I am pleased with the performance and had good results on a bull elk and doe whitetail this past fall both at 200 + yards.

Paul

 

[Washington Hunter]

BHR, Very impressive velocity for a 7/08. My Hodgdon manual shows a max charge of 46.0 grains of H380 with a 140 grain bullet for a velocity of 2770 with an 18 1/2 inch barrel. Of course that data is for a conventional jacketed lead bullet, so I assume the reason you are able to go 5 1/2 grains higher is due to the coating on the XLC bullet. I will be testing out the triple shocks Saturday (if it doesn't rain all day) and I'll let you know how they do.

 

[Maineiac the original]

WH, I have the 5th printing of the Barnes #3 manual it is the latest edition. For a 270win 140 gr X

powder start vol max vol
H4350 50.0 2813 54.0 3038
IMR4350* 49.0 2810 53.0 3039
IMR4831* 52.0 2832 56.0 3050

* is what Barnes recomends

As per the standard start with min and work to max, yada yada yada.

If you need any more of the #'s just say the word. If you are going to try the XXX you may want to call Barnes and see if they recomend something other than the above listed for the uncoated X.

Good luck and enjoy.

 

[Washington Hunter]

Well it's been a couple of months and I've been out to the range 2 or 3 times. The triple shock bullets definitely have potential but I haven't settled on a load yet. With the H4350 I went from 53.0 to 54.5 grains. The only decent group was with the 54.5, 4 shots in about 3/4 inch, with a 5th shot outside of the group by an inch, making for about a 1 1/2 inch group overall. Velocity went from an average of 2901 on up to an average of 2986 with the 54.5 grain charge. This is out of a 22 inch barrel Browning A-bolt. The next time out I tried H4831 and Reloader 22. 58.0 grains of H4831 gave an average of 2976 fps. 57.5 grains of RL22 gave an average of 2942 fps. Groups were good with both powders, just over an inch. Just tonight I loaded up 40 more. I'm trying the H4831 and RL22 again, and another powder I haven't tried yet, RL19. I'm hoping to put 5 shots into a half inch or less this time, with one of those loads. For anybody looking for a good bullet to try, the triple shocks are a good bet. My brother's 300 Win Mag was shooting 3 to 4 inch groups with the Barnes XLC's. When he switched to Triple Shocks, the groups shrunk to 1-1 1/2 inches. I'll post again next week with the results of my next session at the range.

 

[Curly]

WH, do you have any results to post yet?

 

[Washington Hunter]

Sure I do...

57.5 H4831 CCI 250 2920 fps ES: 72
58.0 H4831 CCI 250 2916 fps ES: 38
58.5 H4831 CCI 250 2947 fps ES: 47
58.0 H4831 WIN WLR 2935 fps ES: 23
56.0 RL19 CCI 250 2923 fps ES: 58
56.0 RL19 WIN WLR 2942 fps ES: 24
57.5 RL22 CCI 250 2971 fps ES: 23
57.5 RL22 WIN WLR 2971 fps ES: 56


Velocities are the average of 5 shots, and I also listed the extreme spread. The 4 groups shot with H4831 were pretty good, most being just over an inch. It seems that many groups I have shot with this bullet will have 4 shots in less than an inch, then one flyer that will open the group up to 1 1/2 inches or sometimes close to 2 inches. It could be a problem with the rifle, I'm not sure. But I've decided after trying H4350, H4831, RL19, and RL22, that I am going to stick to using the H4831, which is what I have always used in my 270. I want to experiment some more with the Wincheste WLR primer, as it gave slightly more velocity and lower extreme spreads with both the H4831 and the RL19 loads. Also I am going to try dropping down by 1 or 2 grains and then playing around with the bullet seating depth and try to come up with an accurate load with slightly less pressure. My primers in most of these loads are pretty flat and that is making me nervous. If I lose 30 or 40 fps it won't hurt my feelings any.

 

[1_pointer]

Just a FYI, but H4831 is MUCH more temperature stable than R19 or R22. For me that is important as it could be 75º during deer season and then 5º for a late season cow elk hunt.

Good luck! I have yet to hear a bad thing about the XXXs. Heck, I'd stick with the H4350 load above and go hunting. 1.5" 5 shot groups should be more than adequate for anything from 400yds on in.

 

[Washington Hunter]

1 pointer, yes I just recently read about how RL19 and RL22 may be temperature sensitive, and seeing how there was really no difference in velocities or accuracy between them and either the H4350 or H4831, I'm just going to stick with the H4831 (which is pretty much the "classic" 270 Win powder anyway.) It really is pretty much a toss up between the 4350 and the 4831...but I just happen to have a brand new can of 4831, and the 4350 I had is gone, so that makes it an easy decision. The RL19 and RL22 was my powder my brother had bought to work up loads for his 300 Mag. I think he's going to end up going with H4831 or H1000.

 

[Rogue 6]

I'm not sure if it matters or not to you, but the ramshot line of powders are very temperature stable. They are also ball powders if you like or dislike ball.

 

[Washington Hunter]

Rogue, thanks...have you tried it yourself? I know John Barsness uses Ramshot Hunter for his wife's 270 with the 140 Barnes triple shock. My problem is I don't know where I can buy it. If it was available around here I would probably try it. But still I'm not sure it would be any better than H4831 or H4350.

 

[1_pointer]

Their website has a list of dealers on it. www.ramshot.com

 

[Kraven]

Hey guys I just picked up some X Bullets from the store today.Since I have been shooting Nosler for the last few years I dont have any load data on the X Bullet.I picked up the 140 grain bullet BT in .270 so any help would be appreciated.
Hey WH hows it going with the Triple Shocks I am wanting to try them aswell but the store didnt have any in stock.