Barbie Doll Hunting

[Gr8bawana]

How RMEF can do so poorly on representing it's members is beyond me. That show is an absolute joke. Hopefully Fin's hunts on it this year get positive feedback, and provides a wake up call for them.

While I think RMEF is an organization that is doing good for all of us, the one thing that bothers me whenever I watch their TV show is that they always hunt on private property.
Perhaps they should show us the fruits of their labor by hunting on public land like the rest of us. Show us how our donations are benefiting the average hunter.

 

[MtnWest]

While I think RMEF is an organization that is doing good for all of us, the one thing that bothers me whenever I watch their TV show is that they always hunt on private property.
Perhaps they should show us the fruits of their labor by hunting on public land like the rest of us. Show us how our donations are benefiting the average hunter.

Good post.

 

[Big Fin]

While I think RMEF is an organization that is doing good for all of us, the one thing that bothers me whenever I watch their TV show is that they always hunt on private property.
Perhaps they should show us the fruits of their labor by hunting on public land like the rest of us. Show us how our donations are benefiting the average hunter.

.... Hopefully Fin's hunts on it this year get positive feedback, and provides a wake up call for them.

I hope our episodes do provide that flavor to their TV show. I'm completely confident that they will. They will have some great conservation stories, some hard hiking and difficult hunting conditions, and lucky for us, an elk was taken on all of these hunts.

I would not want to be in the shoes of RMEF as it pertains to trying to film their TV show. Until you go and do these filmed hunts on public land, it is hard to see just how difficult the challenge is. It takes an activity, self-guided public land elk hunting, that already has about 20%+/- success rate, and adds a lot of other logistics and challenges that make it even harder

I cannot explain how we end up with our level of success on our public land elk hunts, other than a lot of luck.

Team Elk has the challenge of trying to tell stories about people involved in conservation, whether they be volunteers, donors, sponsors, or whoever. Most of them are not trained to be on TV. And many of them do not hunt public land. Or if they do hunt public land, they have the average success rate of most other hunters. Toss them into the mix of being on TV, sometimes asking them to carry the storyline, then put them on heavily pressured public land, it is impractical to expect that to result in a good story, kill or no kill.

Each episode of high quality TV costs $25K-30K. You want to get good episodes out of those hunts. You need people who are going to do what you tell them to do, which is not always the case with some very capable hunters. Some hunters are programmed to hunt how they want to hunt, shoot when they want to shoot, and say what they want to say. That's all fine and good when hunting without cameras, but not on TV. So, it is hard to find people willing to do what we ask our guest hunters to do. And, to get them to do it on self-guided public land elk hunts, in front of cameras.

RMEF has tried many self-guided public land episodes. The results have not been very good. Part of the reason they asked one of their board members to host a few episodes. RMEF completely understand the difference between how most their members hunt and what ends up being shown on TV. Having us do episodes for them is part of their response to that.

If RMEF put out a job notice for someone who is experienced on TV, experienced planning and executing self-guided public land elk hunts, able to do what they are told all the time and smile while doing what they are told, require them to do the rest of the year-round trade show/promo circuit, etc. I'm not sure how many qualified applicants they would get. I wish it was different, but public land elk hunting for cameras is very difficult.

I look at how few other shows do public land elk hunts, self-guided. Almost none. And for good reason - It's the hardest thing to do in outdoor TV. The few that do a public land elk episode, usually do it on some pretty exclusive tags, or right in their back yard where they know everything about the terrain and animals. To show up in places you've never been, have five days to figure it out and get a public land elk kill on camera, is a huge challenge. And, from a business perspective, a huge financial risk, given the low success rates of these hunts without cameras, let alone with cameras.

Fortunately for me, our show is not built around killing something every time, or killing huge animals on every tag. So I can take the risk that we might not kill something. If we work hard, we will end up with a story, kill or no kill. Other shows are not built around that model, which is good for us and our unique position in the viewership.

Most every RMEF Team Elk episode talks about how money is being used. Almost all of them I watch show some project and mission related work. Maybe not an entire show built around the project, but a segment that talks about it.

Anyhow, a small sample of the many reasons as to why very few other shows do these self-guided public land elk hunts, not just RMEF.

 

[bmack]

Haven't seen the hunts but I know Tejon in California pretty well as a good friend is the operations manager and I've hunted there for wild pigs several times.

It's an interesting piece of land...actually it is a publicly traded company diversified in a variety of revenue generating verticals (hunting makes up a very small percentage of their revenue).

Their bread and butter is the wild pig hunting which is solid. And, based on the sheer size of the ranch (275,000 acres roughly) they do have a wild herd of around 600 elk that roam the ranch. No fences.

The place is beautiful and they manage the herd in a way to produce big elk with trophy hunts fetching $25k and management bulls about half of that. They kill 390-400" bulls routinely on this place each year which surprised me considering it's an hour north of LA. The terrain ranges from the flat desert and Joshua Tree's to the rolling scrub oaks all the way up to some high rugged alpine conifers.

To me, it's no different than any other big private ranch that RMEF features and hunts on each year...just located an hour from Hollywood.

I don't care for watching these shows as it doesn't relate to me. The "Team Elk" brand would be better served to highlight the majority of their members, the DIY public land hunter. Watching a bunch of semi-famous athletes or personalities on these lay-up type hunts is lame TV...unless Titus was in a thong.

Hopefully Randy can move the brand in the right direction.

 

[----]

.............

 

[Big Fin]

Great message you're sending out RMEF-

A trophy elk hunt on Tejon Ranch is highly prized by hunters throughout the country. This guided hunt guarantees you the opportunity to take a Rocky Mountain bull elk with a gross Boone & Crockett score of 350” or greater.

Your hunt will be scheduled for up to seven days and includes all meals. This is the only hunt that offers exclusive use of a hunting lodge. It also includes transportation on the Ranch and field care of the animal. We will assign up to three guides per hunter, and if a bull is not harvested within the seven day period, we will reschedule the hunt for later in the season. If no bulls are found during the season, we will carry the hunt over to the next year

-Tejon Ranch website. $20,000 for the hunt.

Randy - The hunt where Kristi was on Tejon was for a different TV show; the Swarovski TV show, not Team Elk.

Unless I am mistaken, RMEF has not done an episode on Tejon. I could be wrong, but I don't think they have.

 

[----]

Randy - The hunt where Kristi was on Tejon was for a different TV show; the Swarovski TV show, not Team Elk.

Unless I am mistaken, RMEF has not done an episode on Tejon. I could be wrong, but I don't think they have.

Whoops, I apologize. Didn't realize she has more than one show.

 

[Elkmagnet]

The place is beautiful and they manage the herd in a way to produce big elk with trophy hunts fetching $25k and management bulls about half of that. They kill 390-400" bulls routinely on this place each year

Utah!?

 

[kansasdad]

Utah!?

Home to the former Governator, kallifornyah

 

[2rocky]

I'm pretty conflicted...
I want my daughters to know that "pretty girls can hunt" but the way that the "Barbie Hunter" has developed as a marketing tool for manufactures and tv producers bothers me. There is one in particular that goes by "Samantha" all over the internet that particularly irks me.

I'd share a camp any day with Ms. Titus. I think she is a credible woodswoman as are a few other female bowhunters I've come to know over the years.

 

[Kingsnake]

BigFin-

I read this line from your post:
"I cannot explain how we end up with our level of success on our public land elk hunts, other than a lot of luck."

And I was immediately reminded of the old adage that "Luck is the offspring of meeting Opportunity with Preparation."

You train yourself physically, practice shooting, scout online and in person, and leverage YEARS of experience in the woods. THIS is why you have such so-called "luck."

Many wannabes are looking for a good facebook cover, TV fame, or to push a product. They lack the discipline, work ethic, and patience to be called "hunters." In my opinion, they are doing more harm to the sport than the slob-hunters and poachers.

Keep doin' what you do. You've got a fan for life here!

 

[Elkmagnet]

BigFin-

I read this line from your post:
"I cannot explain how we end up with our level of success on our public land elk hunts, other than a lot of luck."

And I was immediately reminded of the old adage that "Luck is the offspring of meeting Opportunity with Preparation."

You train yourself physically, practice shooting, scout online and in person, and leverage YEARS of experience in the woods. THIS is why you have such so-called "luck."

Many wannabes are looking for a good facebook cover, TV fame, or to push a product. They lack the discipline, work ethic, and patience to be called "hunters." In my opinion, they are doing more harm to the sport than the slob-hunters and poachers.

Keep doin' what you do. You've got a fan for life here!

Teaming up with the random crittergetter or idbugler doesn't hurt either.

 

[huntlife]

I hope our episodes do provide that flavor to their TV show. I'm completely confident that they will. They will have some great conservation stories, some hard hiking and difficult hunting conditions, and lucky for us, an elk was taken on all of these hunts.

I would not want to be in the shoes of RMEF as it pertains to trying to film their TV show. Until you go and do these filmed hunts on public land, it is hard to see just how difficult the challenge is. It takes an activity, self-guided public land elk hunting, that already has about 20%+/- success rate, and adds a lot of other logistics and challenges that make it even harder

I cannot explain how we end up with our level of success on our public land elk hunts, other than a lot of luck.

Team Elk has the challenge of trying to tell stories about people involved in conservation, whether they be volunteers, donors, sponsors, or whoever. Most of them are not trained to be on TV. And many of them do not hunt public land. Or if they do hunt public land, they have the average success rate of most other hunters. Toss them into the mix of being on TV, sometimes asking them to carry the storyline, then put them on heavily pressured public land, it is impractical to expect that to result in a good story, kill or no kill.

Each episode of high quality TV costs $25K-30K. You want to get good episodes out of those hunts. You need people who are going to do what you tell them to do, which is not always the case with some very capable hunters. Some hunters are programmed to hunt how they want to hunt, shoot when they want to shoot, and say what they want to say. That's all fine and good when hunting without cameras, but not on TV. So, it is hard to find people willing to do what we ask our guest hunters to do. And, to get them to do it on self-guided public land elk hunts, in front of cameras.

RMEF has tried many self-guided public land episodes. The results have not been very good. Part of the reason they asked one of their board members to host a few episodes. RMEF completely understand the difference between how most their members hunt and what ends up being shown on TV. Having us do episodes for them is part of their response to that.

If RMEF put out a job notice for someone who is experienced on TV, experienced planning and executing self-guided public land elk hunts, able to do what they are told all the time and smile while doing what they are told, require them to do the rest of the year-round trade show/promo circuit, etc. I'm not sure how many qualified applicants they would get. I wish it was different, but public land elk hunting for cameras is very difficult.

I look at how few other shows do public land elk hunts, self-guided. Almost none. And for good reason - It's the hardest thing to do in outdoor TV. The few that do a public land elk episode, usually do it on some pretty exclusive tags, or right in their back yard where they know everything about the terrain and animals. To show up in places you've never been, have five days to figure it out and get a public land elk kill on camera, is a huge challenge. And, from a business perspective, a huge financial risk, given the low success rates of these hunts without cameras, let alone with cameras.

Fortunately for me, our show is not built around killing something every time, or killing huge animals on every tag. So I can take the risk that we might not kill something. If we work hard, we will end up with a story, kill or no kill. Other shows are not built around that model, which is good for us and our unique position in the viewership.

Most every RMEF Team Elk episode talks about how money is being used. Almost all of them I watch show some project and mission related work. Maybe not an entire show built around the project, but a segment that talks about it.

Anyhow, a small sample of the many reasons as to why very few other shows do these self-guided public land elk hunts, not just RMEF.

Randy brings up a lot of really good points here. Hunting for tv is a lot different. Ive been hunting and filming trying to get a show on a local channel here. We hunt mostly whitetail deer. The majority of our hunts are from treestands or blinds. Its not nearly as hard as hunting elk. But just the fact that you have two people, twice the movement, twice the noise, and twice the scent make it a heck of a lot harder. When you factor in all the money involved, its kinda scary. Tv time is a lot less (between $750 and $1500 depending on the time slot), plus you have to factor in other stuff like cameras, editing software, travel...... The list goes on and on. One of the problems we are faced with when trying to produce a show is its extremely hard for one or two people to get enough quality hunts, not necessarily kills, on film in one year, in one state, to provide a quality hunt. That's why you see a lot of the stuff you see on tv. People pay huge prices to hunt huge animals. That's what most people want to see. Most viewers just want to be entertained.

Im not one of those viewers, and that's not what I want to show. Randys shows are the kind of shows that a huge amount of us want to see. Its real life hunting. Its the same kind of hunting that you and I do. I don't have to see kills every show. As long as the show has a good story line, I love it. My favorite show that ive ever seen Randy do was the one in Wyoming where he almost got snowed out of his camp. If there had not even been an elk in that entire show, I would have loved it.

As for the Barbie shows, they will never go away. Michael Waddell will always be a huge hunting celebrity. Nothing bad against Michael. Ive met him and hes a dang nice guy. T-Bone is one of the nicest people Ive ever met! But, the fact is that most shows will show whatever people want to watch, even if its hunting feeders in a 500 acre fence, while knowing the exact score of every single deer in the pen.

 

[captaincoot]

Playing cabelas outdoor adventures is more manly hunting then fence hunts. Harder to

 

[bigskyblueman]

Cartoon characters disguised as human beings. Ken and Barbie should move over to Spice Channel and make room for some better programming.

 

[bmack]

Utah!?

The ranch I was referring to was the Tejon Ranch in California between Burbank and Bakersfield.

 

[Lawnboy]

I'm pretty conflicted...
I want my daughters to know that "pretty girls can hunt" but the way that the "Barbie Hunter" has developed as a marketing tool for manufactures and tv producers bothers me. There is one in particular that goes by "Samantha" all over the internet that particularly irks me.

I'd share a camp any day with Ms. Titus. I think she is a credible woodswoman as are a few other female bowhunters I've come to know over the years.

I'm pretty sure "Fishing4Eyes's" daughters could hunt circles around almost any "celebrity" women hunters especially on public land. It can be done and those of us with daughters can teach them to be this way if they want to show interest in hunting.

As for TV shows there is so much BS that goes into them. Imagine hunting the same ranch or area year after year. You will end up with mountains of footage of the same terrain which ends up being used for episodes. Having talked to a few videographers who have worked for many of these shows it's appalling what they get away with. You could be looking at footage that was filmed years prior and they make it look like it was on that particular hunt.
Doing what Randy does is pretty much unheard of in the TV industry and the fools who belly ache about no kills are laughable. Not many folks killing animals in 5 days in areas they've never been on public land.

 

[Devil Diver Down]

I cannot explain how we end up with our level of success on our public land elk hunts, other than a lot of luck.

Team Elk has the challenge of trying to tell stories about people involved in conservation, whether they be volunteers, donors, sponsors, or whoever. Most of them are not trained to be on TV. And many of them do not hunt public land. Or if they do hunt public land, they have the average success rate of most other hunters. Toss them into the mix of being on TV, sometimes asking them to carry the storyline, then put them on heavily pressured public land, it is impractical to expect that to result in a good story, kill or no kill.

Even though you're being modest with the claim of luck as formula for success, I'm sure you would agree that good story arcs on tv shows don't just happen via luck - producing matters. Pre-production and preparation count whether it's putting together a hunt or a tv show - I know a little about the former and plenty about the latter (never have combined the 2, until I win the "Hunt with Randy" sweepstakes) and it involves skill.

I get that you want to be kind to RMEF - they do a helluva job promoting hunting along with the tremendous task of opening opportunities. They're a great resource and advocate. I suspect, though, that if you were running their show with your methodology, there would be different results - public land or not. You make your own luck most of the time. Repeatability is not luck, ever.

 

[CabinFever]

It seems like there a some hunting TV personalities who never knew true fair chase hunting, but even more disappointing are the ones who made their way by hunting public land, hard, the way most of us do, but have been over pampered and forgot where they came from and sold out to viewership, money, and easy pen-shoots. I can't for sure say that if I were in their shoes I would stand strong the way Randy does, but I hope so.
Those other shows just strengthen my respect for Randy and OYOA and Fresh Tracks, and I'm also extremely impressed with what Nate has produced for The Western Hunter

 

[Mudranger1]

She is hardcore Greenie! Don't doubt her skills:hump: