Ever notice how often ATV riders try to make excuses rather than address the issue? Here's some good examples:
ATV, cycle riders respond
THELMA GRIMES
News-Sun
April 14, 2004
All-terrain vehicles (ATV) riders recently pleaded with the Benson City Council to consider their rights before taking any action against ATVs in city limits. The plea came just three weeks after residents of southeast Benson complained of dust, noise and the nuisance some riders are creating.
During several Council meetings in January and February, area residents complained that nearly 100 acres of land located in the center of Silverwood Lane, Catarina Drive and Post Road has become a magnet for ATV riders. And why not? The land is prime for the off-road vehicles with plenty of slopes, hills and jumping room.
Carey McQuown, one of the residents registering the complaint, said it wasn't a big problem until this year. He said the riders have become less considerate when it comes to noise, riding close to homes and stirring up dust. Area residents have said there are up to a dozen riders in the area at a time.
With continued complaints, several council members said they would look into the matter. Mayor George Scott went as far to say if a solution couldn't be found ATVs could be banned from city limits.
However, on April 5, Vicky Kramm, a spokeswoman for San Pedro Valley riders, said the 100-acre plot of land should not be closed. She said they have been using the area for nearly 30 years.[this gives them every right to tear the hell out of the place, right?] Kramm was joined at the meeting by at least 20 ATV or motorcycle-riding enthusiasts.
"These riders aren't out to bother anyone," Kramm said. "It's not just kids using the area, it's adults too. All of the old riding places around here are quickly disappearing[hmm, I wonder why?]; shutting the riders down is a big mistake. Working together is a positive answer. If (area residents) are against having the riders there, then there needs to be a designated area for them. It is a proven fact that if kids don't have anything to do they find something to do and it's generally bad."
Kramm, who admitted her 10-year-old son doesn't even use the area in question, said she is speaking out for the riders in general. She said the sport is a growing trend and is becoming more and more popular in the San Pedro Valley.
"Riding quads and dirt bikes is not any different than other activities," Kramm said. "The football players get a football field to practice, the baseball players have a field, why can't we? These trails have been here for 30 years. I would think they would find something better to complain about."[Ah, instead of addressing the issue, blame it on the people doing the complaining]
However, one of the complaints is the riders are using private property without permission. Benson Police Chief Glenn Nichols said there has always been a problem in the area but more so in the last year.
When asked if the riders had a right to continue using private property, Kramm said she didn't know. Kramm admitted she didn't know who owns the land where residents have complained that private property signs have been posted but torn down by riders.[hey, we don't know who owns it, but we have the right to tear the hell out of the place!]
Instead, Kramm said the city should be setting more codes and regulations for the riders to follow.[I imagine there's already some kind of law on the book regarding trespass]
In another issue raised by residents, Faline Colglazier, located on three acres of land near the heart of the ATV trails, said dust caused by riders affects her breathing, caused runoff problems and impacted area wildlife.
"This has gone way beyond fun, now someone is going to get hurt," Colglazier said in March. "I'm not trying to be a troublemaker, but we have put up with this way too long."
Referring to Colglazier's comments in the April 7 edition of the San Pedro Valley News-Sun, Kramm said Colglazier was "exaggerating," especially about the plants and wildlife.
"She is not a wildlife expert," Kramm said. "They are also complaining about the dust, what do they do when the wind blows?[more excuses] And saying someone is going to get hurt is just the oldest excuse.[and what happens if someone gets hurt or killed on that private property? As stupid as it is, there's precedent for idiots like this suing the landowner] All the riders here have crashed at some point, they know their limits."
Can there be a middle ground? One side says ATV riders have a right to practice the sport they love, while the other says residents and property owners have a right to quality of life.
When asked if a solution could be found, Kramm said "Yes, if we can all work together. I would rather have these kids out riding instead of concocting a plan to take a gun to school."
Besides Kramm, St. David resident Kiri Hall has also spoken up in favor of riders. Hall said she and her husband ride ATVs regularly.
"If ATV and dirt bikes are banned within city limits - you've just eliminated some of the problem, and most likely those offenders are present offenders and the problem will most likely continue," Hall said in a letter to the editor.
The City Council has not discussed the ATV issue any further since the April 5 meeting and no action has been taken.
********************************************************
Response from one of the landowners:
Riders don't respect land
In response to the letter from Kiri Hall, a dirt bike rider from St. David:
Let me tell you what it's like living close to an area bike and ATV riders consider "theirs." I have had the obnoxious noise from these machines at 1 a.m. as well as 5 a.m. Time of day or night matters little to these people.
I have had groups of 10 or more roar down my private road, as fast as they can go, making as much noise as they can possibly make and stirring up as much dust on my private road as possible. I am probably 50 feet from my road and the dust has been so thick you would not know there was a house there at all. When I have tried to stop them by posting signs, they steal the signs. When I have tried to stop them to ask them to respect private property, they give me the universal crude sign for - well, you know.
I have called the Sheriff's Department numerous times. Either the riders are gone by the time the deputy can get here, or they run and the deputies are unable to catch them.
The destruction these people do to my road has to be corrected and maintained by my husband. There is no government entity to come out and repair the damage they cause. It costs our money in gas, and depreciation on our equipment.
The privately owned desert these inconsiderate, uncaring, selfish people have destroyed will never come back. It is worthless now, due to the permanent damage done by these "fun-loving" people.
I would love to know how you would like dealing with these things on a constant basis. Nothing gets through to selfish inconsiderate people. I for one would dearly love to see the entire county ban your wonderful dirt bikes and ATVs, because no matter where you ride them you will do destruction of some sort.
So don't talk to me about "Why We Can't All Just Get Along"!
Patricia Mitchell
Benson
ATV, cycle riders respond
THELMA GRIMES
News-Sun
April 14, 2004
All-terrain vehicles (ATV) riders recently pleaded with the Benson City Council to consider their rights before taking any action against ATVs in city limits. The plea came just three weeks after residents of southeast Benson complained of dust, noise and the nuisance some riders are creating.
During several Council meetings in January and February, area residents complained that nearly 100 acres of land located in the center of Silverwood Lane, Catarina Drive and Post Road has become a magnet for ATV riders. And why not? The land is prime for the off-road vehicles with plenty of slopes, hills and jumping room.
Carey McQuown, one of the residents registering the complaint, said it wasn't a big problem until this year. He said the riders have become less considerate when it comes to noise, riding close to homes and stirring up dust. Area residents have said there are up to a dozen riders in the area at a time.
With continued complaints, several council members said they would look into the matter. Mayor George Scott went as far to say if a solution couldn't be found ATVs could be banned from city limits.
However, on April 5, Vicky Kramm, a spokeswoman for San Pedro Valley riders, said the 100-acre plot of land should not be closed. She said they have been using the area for nearly 30 years.[this gives them every right to tear the hell out of the place, right?] Kramm was joined at the meeting by at least 20 ATV or motorcycle-riding enthusiasts.
"These riders aren't out to bother anyone," Kramm said. "It's not just kids using the area, it's adults too. All of the old riding places around here are quickly disappearing[hmm, I wonder why?]; shutting the riders down is a big mistake. Working together is a positive answer. If (area residents) are against having the riders there, then there needs to be a designated area for them. It is a proven fact that if kids don't have anything to do they find something to do and it's generally bad."
Kramm, who admitted her 10-year-old son doesn't even use the area in question, said she is speaking out for the riders in general. She said the sport is a growing trend and is becoming more and more popular in the San Pedro Valley.
"Riding quads and dirt bikes is not any different than other activities," Kramm said. "The football players get a football field to practice, the baseball players have a field, why can't we? These trails have been here for 30 years. I would think they would find something better to complain about."[Ah, instead of addressing the issue, blame it on the people doing the complaining]
However, one of the complaints is the riders are using private property without permission. Benson Police Chief Glenn Nichols said there has always been a problem in the area but more so in the last year.
When asked if the riders had a right to continue using private property, Kramm said she didn't know. Kramm admitted she didn't know who owns the land where residents have complained that private property signs have been posted but torn down by riders.[hey, we don't know who owns it, but we have the right to tear the hell out of the place!]
Instead, Kramm said the city should be setting more codes and regulations for the riders to follow.[I imagine there's already some kind of law on the book regarding trespass]
In another issue raised by residents, Faline Colglazier, located on three acres of land near the heart of the ATV trails, said dust caused by riders affects her breathing, caused runoff problems and impacted area wildlife.
"This has gone way beyond fun, now someone is going to get hurt," Colglazier said in March. "I'm not trying to be a troublemaker, but we have put up with this way too long."
Referring to Colglazier's comments in the April 7 edition of the San Pedro Valley News-Sun, Kramm said Colglazier was "exaggerating," especially about the plants and wildlife.
"She is not a wildlife expert," Kramm said. "They are also complaining about the dust, what do they do when the wind blows?[more excuses] And saying someone is going to get hurt is just the oldest excuse.[and what happens if someone gets hurt or killed on that private property? As stupid as it is, there's precedent for idiots like this suing the landowner] All the riders here have crashed at some point, they know their limits."
Can there be a middle ground? One side says ATV riders have a right to practice the sport they love, while the other says residents and property owners have a right to quality of life.
When asked if a solution could be found, Kramm said "Yes, if we can all work together. I would rather have these kids out riding instead of concocting a plan to take a gun to school."
Besides Kramm, St. David resident Kiri Hall has also spoken up in favor of riders. Hall said she and her husband ride ATVs regularly.
"If ATV and dirt bikes are banned within city limits - you've just eliminated some of the problem, and most likely those offenders are present offenders and the problem will most likely continue," Hall said in a letter to the editor.
The City Council has not discussed the ATV issue any further since the April 5 meeting and no action has been taken.
********************************************************
Response from one of the landowners:
Riders don't respect land
In response to the letter from Kiri Hall, a dirt bike rider from St. David:
Let me tell you what it's like living close to an area bike and ATV riders consider "theirs." I have had the obnoxious noise from these machines at 1 a.m. as well as 5 a.m. Time of day or night matters little to these people.
I have had groups of 10 or more roar down my private road, as fast as they can go, making as much noise as they can possibly make and stirring up as much dust on my private road as possible. I am probably 50 feet from my road and the dust has been so thick you would not know there was a house there at all. When I have tried to stop them by posting signs, they steal the signs. When I have tried to stop them to ask them to respect private property, they give me the universal crude sign for - well, you know.
I have called the Sheriff's Department numerous times. Either the riders are gone by the time the deputy can get here, or they run and the deputies are unable to catch them.
The destruction these people do to my road has to be corrected and maintained by my husband. There is no government entity to come out and repair the damage they cause. It costs our money in gas, and depreciation on our equipment.
The privately owned desert these inconsiderate, uncaring, selfish people have destroyed will never come back. It is worthless now, due to the permanent damage done by these "fun-loving" people.
I would love to know how you would like dealing with these things on a constant basis. Nothing gets through to selfish inconsiderate people. I for one would dearly love to see the entire county ban your wonderful dirt bikes and ATVs, because no matter where you ride them you will do destruction of some sort.
So don't talk to me about "Why We Can't All Just Get Along"!
Patricia Mitchell
Benson
You don't suppose somebody has been forgetting to wear their helmet.....
