Article on Elk Disturbance in Steamboat

[LuketheDog]

I think this effect is also compounded by shifting baseline syndrome, with massive portions of communities being recent transplants they don't realize that the number of animals they are seeing is 50% of what was there was 10 years ago.

Absolutely, people who don't know any better see a handful of elk off I-70 on their way home from skiing/biking/hiking in the mountains and think that's so great, they're everywhere! But it's really not indicative of general I-70 corridor herd health.

 

[cedahm]

I am unaware the degree to which this might already be in place in Routt county, but I know from my time in Boulder that seasonal closures are a thing, and not very controversial as far as I saw. (Although it may not always have been. )

And as MTelkHuntress points out, this also speaks very loudly to the misconceptions that many have about what harms wildlife. It's obviously super easy to understand how a hunter removes an animal from the landscape, but less so a mountain biker, or <insert recreation here>. It feels that talking about game species muddies the waters a bit.

There are already a number of seasonal closures:

Medicine Bow-Routt National Forests & Thunder Basin National Grassland - Alerts & Closures

Medicine Bow-Routt National Forests & Thunder Basin National Grassland - Alerts & Closures

www.fs.usda.gov

But scale of use in summer is also 'displacing' activity - The two major trailheads north of town (Red Dirt and Mad Creek) are generally full, and double-parked down the pavement on weekends, from June through October (the predominate vehicles just shift from Subarus with MTB racks to Full-tons pulling Horse Trailers around Labor Day).

The downside to all this is the more Steamboat has problems and limits access, the more of those people drive to Saratoga.

I think this is an apt comparison and it also mirrors Steamboat's growth as a recreation destination. Steamboat's population has doubled in the 27 years I've been going there AND the tourist usage has increased. 1.1M visitor-days in summer of 2019 for a town of 12K people. Believe that is doubled over the prior decade (data is inconsistent, but some links below):

Summer 2019 Economic Impact Report
2016 Summer Visitor Report

Hard to draw detailed conclusions, but I think safe to say that ALL the mountain towns are seeing increases (simply due to population size of the state), and towns off the I70/I25 corridor are seeing more use than prior as the 'traditional' hotspots (Summit, Vail, Estes) become more and more crowded.

All in all - Groups like KRW that encompass more than one recreation user group are going to be absolutely crucial to moderating impacts to local areas.

 

[nrpate05]

I wonder how effective the seasonal closures are. I'm sure there are studies on whether people follow them or not. No doubt enforcement of these closures is minimal.

 

[kentuckybow]

I have always thought backpackers and hikers do more damage to elk than hunters ever did, just from my observations.

 

[Bigjay73]

I thought making a season for shed hunting alleviated the pressure on the elk herds.

 

[Deleted member 52098]

I think this effect is also compounded by shifting baseline syndrome, with massive portions of communities being recent transplants they don't realize that the number of animals they are seeing is 50% of what was there was 10 years ago.

Not sure how I got on this thread, but having lived in Eagle for a bit, thought I might chime in.

one @wllm is absolutely correct. The first few sightings of wildlife in Colorado that were not present in your former home state of X, make you believe that these animals are everywhere. They seem infinitely more populous than your former home. Then you start visiting places like Estes and RMNP and suddenly your confirmation bias is through the roof... "Colorado has elk everywhere!"

Secondly, Eagle is seeing a huge population boom and like a lot of people, that idiot at the Vail Daily believes that Eagle is the next great MTB location - much like Fruita has become. What they cannot reconcile - or most cannot reconcile - is that Eagle was a blip on the radar a long time ago, MTB wasn't as popular and the location of their big trail systems was absolutely an area for elk and deer. There are golf courses popping up back near public lands, housing developments where ag / ranch land used to be and suddenly a lot of safe spaces are gone.

I am a firm believer in seasonal closures, we have one right here near my house and it just opened yesterday. It's shut down for 6.5 months as it constitutes a pretty critical habitat for winter range for the elk. More of these need to happen and in a way that they can be monitored, to the extent that is possible. It's also our job to help educate people on why this is important. I believe if we take the point of view that herds are smaller and we have less to consume, its the wrong angle. While that ultimately does matter to us, I'd be hard pressed to believe that all of us are't more interested in also just having more elk to view / ogle / be in awe of.

stepping off my soapbox for the day

 

[jlmatthew]

I think this effect is also compounded by shifting baseline syndrome, with massive portions of communities being recent transplants they don't realize that the number of animals they are seeing is 50% of what was there was 10 years ago.

This!

Unfortunately if you saw what the Eagle area had 20+ years ago it’s really depressing. 35/36 were my favorite GMU’s to hunt.

It’s the same when I visit my friends in Craig and talk to the hunters and they all rave about how great it is and all the game. But if you’ve seen the huge decline in deer like I have the past 10+ years you quit hunting in the area because you feel so bad taking one out of the population

 

[Flatbrimmer]

There are already a number of seasonal closures:



View attachment 218300

I don’t know any of these places and I can appreciate that they recommend some less at-risk areas. Can someone tell me though, do the recommended areas still provide wildlife based recreation like shed hunting and wildlife viewing from afar- in a manner that wouldn’t disturb what animals may be present? Or are these places where one can expect it’s only going to be dog walkers and bike riders- if you want to be in the woods with the critters, you won’t find them in the Green section and that’s the point?

 

[Deleted member 28227]

This!

Unfortunately if you saw what the Eagle area had 20+ years ago it’s really depressing. 35/36 were my favorite GMU’s to hunt.

100%

I hardly ever see deer in the yard any more but I remember some truly massive bucks hanging out in our yard back in the day.

 

[Irrelevant]

New Study Shows 40% of Colorado’s Most Important Elk Habitat Is Affected by Recreational Trail Use | Theodore Roosevelt Conservation Partnership

Geospatial analysis shows extent of overlap and highlights opportunities for responsible recreation management.

www.trcp.org

 

[Oak]

Don’t you people know what “non-consumptive” means?

 

[Oak]

Pretty good article about the TRCP report @neffa3 linked above.

Colorado’s world-class elk herd in bull’s-eye of outdoor recreation boom, report warns

A new report by a sportsmen’s group says 40% of the elk’s most important habitat overlaps with recreation trails in Colorado, a trend that could affect the herd’s long-term health…

www.denverpost.com

 

[millerkiller77]

I've hunted GMU 4 three times over a six year span, Last time was 2017.. I am a NR so my opinions are merely from personal observation and not directed towards one group more than the other. I was successful my first and last year, opted not to return because of the overcrowding

First off there are way too many outfitters in this zone. They are setting up camps weeks in advance and then shuttling in Dozens of hunters on horseback immediately before opening, including the night before. Trails that used to be difficult to follow on foot or horseback are now wide enough to be used by atv traffic.
Campers, trailers, and motor homes are parked along the sides of every road that is accessible . Atvs & SxS use the FS roads like a freeway network from sun up to sun down, it's similar to a drunk Baja 500 in the forest.
Trash, wow! I cannot believe how much shit people haul in and then leave behind, and it's not just limited to designated camp sites.
Summer season usage by mountain bikes,hikers, Starbucks folks,and the OHV crowd isn't doing that zone any favors either, it's a year round deluge of people.

It's just too many people representing a variety of hobbies/interests for that small of an area. The state of CO should be ashamed of how many tags they issue for this zone. I really love visiting Moffet/Routt counties but they need to restrict access......

 

[grasshopper]

It amazes me how folks can read a dam letter to the editor or some biased TRCP article and not question any of it. Must be gospel around here if it comes from left leaning TRCP or BHA.

Everyone still points back to Vail and E-16, where CPW shot the crap out of the herd, and needed a scapegoat. After CPW blames trails, CPW then determines, they need to limit archers in E-16 to "save the herd" all the while they are still issuing rifle cow tags in unit 45 valid during the archery season, a ton of PLO cow tags, list B cow tags, and even either sex rifle tags?

At the time, I'm in a discussion with the then regional manager trying to stand up for bowhunters, and he flat out told me the point of the issue was to make an example of Eagle and Pitkin counties trail programs to use elsewhere so bowhunters had to be limited to make that public declaration.

Now the E-16 2022 herd projection is 8530 elk, well within management objectives, getting close to exceeding them with the same dam trails in place, but cow tags virtually cut off. Populations has nearly doubled since 2017 estimate of ~4600.

I guess placing blame worked, because everyone cites Eagle and Pitkin county trails as the reason for the decline, yet no one questions Bill Andee about why CPW staff OK'd shooting the crap out of the herd (including either sex PLO rifle tags) while the decline was happening. It couldn't possibly be CPW?

Now look at E-2, with the best cow/calf ratio in the state. According to CPW in 2020 there was 18,000 elk (at the top of the objective), in 2021 all of sudden the say there is 24,000 elk. Huh? Projecting 2022 to be at 25,000 elk. That recreation is just destroying them, ain't it.

Holy crap the sky is falling, better shut out recreationalists. Whatever TRCP and CPW say must be gospel. Look at the studies of elk fleeing, then come to my house where they don't flee an inch. I tend to believe my own eyes. I'm skeptical.

E-16 license history
Page 7 elk pops and license quotas

 

[nrpate05]

all the while they are still issuing rifle cow tags in unit 45 valid during the archery season,

Do you know how I can get one of those tags? Hunt code??

 

[TOGIE]

I’m gonna coin a new term - eyeball biology

I like it

 

[grasshopper]

Do you know how I can get one of those tags? Hunt code??

They did away with them when we brought it to their attention. Scour the regs though, we also had to suggest maybe doing away with list B cow tags would help with crowding. I'm sure you can find something