another: Picking my 1st Muzzleloader.

[BrokenChicken]

hey guys,
just another one of those threads *(and yes i did search and read through ton of other threads). but thought i'd ask your opinion.
looking to get a Muzzleloader this year to practice and then plan a hunt with it in 2023.
it seems that there are 3 main brands that keep coming up: CVA, Traditions, Thompson. not knowing much about one over the other, i'm for some reason leaning more towards CVA. so here's my criteria:
Budget: +/- a hundred, i'm looking at middle of the pack at $500-$700 seems to have lots of good choices.
Cal: .50cal to cover all possible hunts. sure maybe in few years if i really get into it, i'd look at .45 or .40 to get more state/species specific, but for now .50 should do the job
State: CO - home state and where i plan on using it. NE - neighboring state with Muzzy seasons so i like the idea of going there as well. but being CO primary state i would keep this Open Sights only.

heres what i'm looking at so far: (all in .50cal)
CVA Accura LR-X - really like the look of this.
CVA Accura MR-x - very close 2nd
Traditions Vortek Strikeforce
TC ProHunter F/X

what i dont understand yet about Muzzleloaders, that perhaps some of you can help answer:
- Barrel twist - there is difference between above listed models
- Barrel lengths - staying between 26" to 30" is there much difference?

anything else i should know?

what would you guys recommend?
thanks

 

[perma]

I just made a new muzzie thread. CVA was a good choice, but their customer service is pretty bad. I’ve been waiting for 3 days for a call back and email and no reply. I also like Thompson.

 

[Redman]

I have had all of them. My preference is T/C. I have an Encore and was going to buy a .50 cal MZ barrel for it but found a Impact of their's for less than I could buy the barrel for. So I bought it and it is very accurate. Not sure how they can sell a complete gun for 1/2 the price of a barrel but oh well. The scope mounts are the same as the Encore so I can swap scopes between my Encore barrels and the Impact MZ.
My parents bought me a Traditions .50 cal Hawken with a 1-48 twist barrel when I was 15. I am soon to be 47 and that gun has killed a bunch of deer and is very accurate with Hornaday Great Plains Bullets. It is pretty rough looking now but I can put a 100gr of FF black powder and a Hornady GP bullet in it and hit anything out to 100yds with it every time.

 

[BrentD]

hey guys,
just another one of those threads *(and yes i did search and read through ton of other threads). but thought i'd ask your opinion.
looking to get a Muzzleloader this year to practice and then plan a hunt with it in 2023.
it seems that there are 3 main brands that keep coming up: CVA, Traditions, Thompson. not knowing much about one over the other, i'm for some reason leaning more towards CVA. so here's my criteria:
Budget: +/- a hundred, i'm looking at middle of the pack at $500-$700 seems to have lots of good choices.
Cal: .50cal to cover all possible hunts. sure maybe in few years if i really get into it, i'd look at .45 or .40 to get more state/species specific, but for now .50 should do the job
State: CO - home state and where i plan on using it. NE - neighboring state with Muzzy seasons so i like the idea of going there as well. but being CO primary state i would keep this Open Sights only.

heres what i'm looking at so far: (all in .50cal)
CVA Accura LR-X - really like the look of this.
CVA Accura MR-x - very close 2nd
Traditions Vortek Strikeforce
TC ProHunter F/X

what i dont understand yet about Muzzleloaders, that perhaps some of you can help answer:
- Barrel twist - there is difference between above listed models
- Barrel lengths - staying between 26" to 30" is there much difference?

anything else i should know?

what would you guys recommend?
thanks

All though you don't say so explictly, it appears you are not interested in a traditional hunting rifle, but keep in mind that a .50 is not legal for elk in with roundballs in CO. I'm not sure .45 or .40s are with any projectile but may be wrong about that. Colorado has some fairly well thought out projectile requirements and may have other rules as well, but the roundball one would concern me if I were in your shoes.

Twist is absolutely the most important variable once you have chosen a rifle, but you need to know what sort of projectiles you will want for hunting and for general shooting (if you do that at all).

Barrel length is not quite as important, but I would opt for longer barrels in traditional rifles for several different reasons.

 

[BrokenChicken]

All though you don't say so explictly, it appears you are not interested in a traditional hunting rifle, but keep in mind that a .50 is not legal for elk in with roundballs in CO. I'm not sure .45 or .40s are with any projectile but may be wrong about that. Colorado has some fairly well thought out projectile requirements and may have other rules as well, but the roundball one would concern me if I were in your shoes.

Twist is absolutely the most important variable once you have chosen a rifle, but you need to know what sort of projectiles you will want for hunting and for general shooting (if you do that at all).

Barrel length is not quite as important, but I would opt for longer barrels in traditional rifles for several different reasons.

thanks for reply,
i did look at CO regs and as my home state this is absolutely the reason i want to ensure i'm legal for CO Elk. all other species will then be extra and should also be legal
i was looking at CVA (again i really like Accural LR-X .5o for some reason) and hoping to then match it with Powerbelt Aerotip Copper .50 cal(or something similar) , which my understanding is 100% legal in CO (.50cal and its Not a Sabot?) or did i mistakenly misunderstood this?
thanks again for your reply.

 

[BrokenChicken]

also CVA Accura has 1:28 twist,
would i be better off with Vortek Strikeforce which has 1:24 twist

 

[RyGuy]

I have a traditions pursuit and it shoots good, but I have to clean it between every shot or else it shoots all over the place. And it came with really crappy open sights. It’s been a pain trying to put on a globe and peep sight that actually fit the gun. My dad has a different brand…. Can’t remember what it is, but it shoots really well and is more tolerant to shooting without cleaning

 

[CowboyLeroy]

Go with the Accura, the nitride bergara barrels are very nice

 

[Addicting]

I like CVA and that is what I use. Thinks to keep in mind is recoil. A Mountain Rifle Muzzy is going to make you hurt. It’s not meant to be shoulder friendly. It’s meant to be light to carry. My Accura V2 is a dream to carry but it has stiff recoil. A 300 grain bullet at 2000 Fps will keep your range sessions short. My shoulder hurts from 6 shots this morning.

 

[Addicting]

Secondly, 209 shotgun primers are very hard to come by. DO NOT use muzzleloader 209. They don’t have the power standard 209 have and will not ignite BH209. A ignition system that uses a large rifle magnum primer would be my choice if buying new.

 

[Bullshot]

Secondly, 209 shotgun primers are very hard to come by. DO NOT use muzzleloader 209. They don’t have the power standard 209 have and will not ignite BH209. A ignition system that uses a large rifle magnum primer would be my choice if buying new.

But DO use the muzzleloader 209 if you are using 777 loose powder. Limits the crud ring in my experience.

 

[EKYHunter]

Remington Clean Bore primers are great with 777 if you can find them.

 

[Sask hunter]

I have a TC triumph I really like. Debated the Remington 700 ultimate but couldn’t justify the $$$ for how little I muzzle loader hunt

 

[utah400elk]

I just picked up a new CVA as a project. It’s an .50 Accura V2. I also have a .50 Knight Disc Extreme and and .45 Arrowhead custom build.

For a production gun…I really like the Knight ultra lite. However, my Knight Disc Extreme shoots 460 grn No-Excuse really well and is a great gun.

My new CVA looks like it will do well and I am going to set it up as a 2nd CO gun with 285 grn Star Tip 2P or 300 grn fury…whichever shoots best.

To your question…The Knight ultra lite would stretch you budget a bit to much, about 1K plus. The CvA looks like it will shoot well and I have high hopes.
Having over 20 plus years of muzzleloader hunting, I would highly recommend going for a nitride barrel. You could go for an TC encore and have the ability to swap barrels to .45 later if you decide to go that route. Arrowhead barrels are drop in for the encore and would make an awesome rifle.

Also, I would not want the 30 inch barrel. Would be very front heavy and too long in the woods. I really like the 1 in 20 for the .45 and the 1 in 28 has always shot really well in the .50 caliber. The great thing about muzzleloaders is that they take a bit of fitness to figure out what works best and two rifles are seldom the same. JMO

 

[BrokenChicken]

thanks guys, appreciate all the feedback over the weekend. i am leaning towards CVA Accura LR-X but based on that last comment i will also take a closer look at MR-X

 

[BrokenChicken]

I just picked up a new CVA as a project. It’s an .50 Accura V2. I also have a .50 Knight Disc Extreme and and .45 Arrowhead custom build.

For a production gun…I really like the Knight ultra lite. However, my Knight Disc Extreme shoots 460 grn No-Excuse really well and is a great gun.

My new CVA looks like it will do well and I am going to set it up as a 2nd CO gun with 285 grn Star Tip 2P or 300 grn fury…whichever shoots best.

To your question…The Knight ultra lite would stretch you budget a bit to much, about 1K plus. The CvA looks like it will shoot well and I have high hopes.
Having over 20 plus years of muzzleloader hunting, I would highly recommend going for a nitride barrel. You could go for an TC encore and have the ability to swap barrels to .45 later if you decide to go that route. Arrowhead barrels are drop in for the encore and would make an awesome rifle.

Also, I would not want the 30 inch barrel. Would be very front heavy and too long in the woods. I really like the 1 in 20 for the .45 and the 1 in 28 has always shot really well in the .50 caliber. The great thing about muzzleloaders is that they take a bit of fitness to figure out what works best and two rifles are seldom the same. JMO

thanks again for your input,.
$1K would be little too much than i want to spend.

i am really interested in your last note, 30" barrel being too long, would you suggest Accura MR-X vs LR-X ? only difference is 26" vs 30".
my thinking is that even at closer distances 30" will be more accurate and produce more velocity FPS ?
not to start a sh*tstorm and not that i would look to take long shots, but i'd like to be confident in guns ability to shoot to its max potential, and with 30" would i be able to do so further out *(with proper practice at the range of course and all) ?
thanks

 

[Addicting]

thanks again for your input,.
$1K would be little too much than i want to spend.

i am really interested in your last note, 30" barrel being too long, would you suggest Accura MR-X vs LR-X ? only difference is 26" vs 30".
my thinking is that even at closer distances 30" will be more accurate and produce more velocity FPS ?
not to start a sh*tstorm and not that i would look to take long shots, but i'd like to be confident in guns ability to shoot to its max potential, and with 30" would i be able to do so further out *(with proper practice at the range of course and all) ?
thanks

I would more look at the weight than worry about the 4” of barrel. To get the max out of them your going to have recoil, lots of it.

Then look at your style of hunting. If your in the woods 90% of the time then the shorter barrel will be good. Most of mine is in fields and parks so I would rather have a the 4” and the extra reach.

 

[BrokenChicken]

I would more look at the weight than worry about the 4” of barrel. To get the max out of them your going to have recoil, lots of it.

Then look at your style of hunting. If your in the woods 90% of the time then the shorter barrel will be good. Most of mine is in fields and parks so I would rather have a the 4” and the extra reach.

thanks, my logic was somewhere along this as well.
having never hunted with Muzzloader i really "dont know what i dont know" but knowing my personal style of hunting, i like to cover ground, set up in good glassing areas that will require more than just a 50 yard shot. knowing myself i probably won't still hunt through the woods.
weight difference is about 3/4 of lbs according to spec sheet. either of the weights are well with in what my scoped rifle is, so not a big deal.

but i do want to be able to use this for mule deer hunting in the future, which i mostly do out in more open sage brush/ thinly treed pine areas, etc.
i too want the ability for more accurate rifle for extra reach.
thanks

 

[utah400elk]

When I got my knight ultra lite I almost got the mountaineer because of the longer barrel length. Check out this link…

http://www.namlhunt.com/mltesting-4-6.html

Very interesting and helped me choose the shorter barrel. Not worth the PIA for extra 4 inch. Now if you sit in a box blind and hunt cut fields/shooting lanes then maybe the 4 inch extra might make sense. I have never wanted the extra barrel length and almost all of my hunting has been out west.

 

[Addicting]

When I got my knight ultra lite I almost got the mountaineer because of the longer barrel length. Check out this link…

http://www.namlhunt.com/mltesting-4-6.html

Very interesting and helped me choose the shorter barrel. Not worth the PIA for extra 4 inch. Now if you sit in a box blind and hunt cut fields/shooting lanes then maybe the 4 inch extra might make sense. I have never wanted the extra barrel length and almost all of my hunting has been out west.

Thanks for posting that, it is a good read and interesting test.