2 gun do-all battery suggestions?

[mrjashu]

Having started hunting later in life I only have two hunting rifles. Chambered in ..... 6.5 creedmoor and 300wsm, so I think you're on the right track

My thought process has been this. 6.5 is the primary on all deer / antelope sized game. It's a good all 'rounder that is easy to shoot really well. The 300 wsm is an able backup in all of those scenarios and is the primary for elk / bear / moose / whatever else. In the case of elk the 6.5 is a sufficient backup at reasonable ranges. Both are short action and easy to carry. I reload so I can shoot a whole range of bullet weights in either.

A 7mm would be right in the middle and if I could only have one rifle it would be a 7mm (probably a 280ai) but since I have two I spread the difference out a little bit.
Hope that helps.

 

[Laelkhunter]

My personal two gun battery is a Thompson/Center Venture 30/06 shooting 168 Barnes TTSX and a .340 Weatherby shooting 225 Barnes TTSX

 

[elkduds]

In a light rifle, 6ish # scoped, 270 nonmag is my personal threshold for accuracy due to recoil, unbraked. 270 w 130 accubond per Randy's list is versatile as well. I have great confidence in my 9# 7RM, but that is beyond the scope (pun intended) of Randy's exercise.

 

[Melman]

I'm interested to see the comments you might have for this. Howa and I have been working on a project somewhat similar. We are trying to find a combination of cartridge, weight, length, barrel taper, etc that will be the most versatile option for the western hunter who is only going to buy one rifle, possibly two.

Right now I have these rifles we are working with for the test, along with the ammo choices I am using based on past experience with these cartridges. All have H-S Precision stocks and are topped with Leupold VX-5 or VX-6 scopes.

6.5 CM 22" barrel - 129 grain Nosler AccuBond Long Range

.270 Win 22" barrel - 130 grain Nosler AccuBond

7mm-.08 22" barrel - 140 grain Nosler E-Tip and 140 grain Nosler Accubond

.308 Win 22" barrel - 165 grain Nosler Partition and 168 grain Nosler E-Tip

.308 Win 26" barrel - - 165 grain Nosler Partition and 168 grain Nosler E-Tip

.300 Win Mag 24" barrel - 180 grain Nosler AccuBond

.300 Win Mag 26" barrel - 180 grain Nosler E-Tip


I'm finding the hard part is to find the balance of weight versus cost. Even the lightest of these is more weight than my Alpine Mountain Rifles. But, the cost is significantly lower. Some are willing to pay that higher cost, some are not.

All are cerakoted, which is a pretty low additional cost for the weather-deterring benefits. All have come with factory trigger settings at 2.75#. Not sure if that will be allowed in a retail rifle, due to liability concerns, but the Howa trigger is a really good trigger and even "gooder" when set below 3.0#.

With no compromise for accuracy, the traits we are trying to balance are performance for the widest array of western hunting, cost, weight, ammo availability, durability, and low maintenance. It is turning out to be a harder project than I expected, given how many different situations we hunt in and how many different species we pursue.

Interested to continue following the discussion. Thanks to the original poster for starting this topic.

So far the leader is the 7mm-.08 as the all-around versatile cartridge, but I fear my past biases is influencing that decision. We'll see if that changes when we start in the heavy part of our elk hunting calendar.

Is the goal to narrow it down to only offer one or two calibers total in the new line?

if that is the case I think you have to go 1 short action as light as you can make it. Get it as close to the Alpine Mt Rifle's weight as you can. The Second would have to be a long range magnum where you aren't as worried about the weight
I'd say a .308 20" #1 contour barrel and then a 300 win mag with a 24" #2 barrel would really appeal to a lot of hunters.
I'm bias to the .308win so I'd rather have it but a 6.5cm might be the way to go to sell more rifles in todays market. I'm sure Howa knows what people are buying so they can make that call

 

[LCH]

I wouldn't want to limit myself to just 2 big game rifles, but I am taking 2 to Wyoming this year.. A walnut/blued metal 30-06, and a synthetic/stainless 30-06.

 

[MLaird]

If only one rifle, I would go with a 270, but I would prefer it to have a 24" barrel. I like a little more zip on the Barnes that I shoot.

If 2 rifles, I would keep the 270. The 308 with a 26" barrel is intriguing, but would probably go with a 300 wm.

 

[LopeHunter]

A consideration is how likely is the closest store going to have a box of ammunition for each of your rifles in a 2-rifle system? Even a hunter that reloads can end up needing to get a box of ammo off the shelf. Baggage gets lost, stolen, things fall out of packs, etc.

Will you travel beyond U.S. and Canada during your hunts? .30-06 ammo is found about anywhere rifle ammo is sold and if none sold but are around other hunters then one of them might have that caliber.

I shoot a .25-06 and 338 Win Mag for hunting. Have not shot a .22 in decades. Have not reloaded in 35 years. Finding ammo for my rifles is not as easy as some calibers but easier than some of the exotic calibers. I have no hunting trips planned beyond America.

 

[std7mag]

I can throw 50 rounds of any ammo i load in the truck at any time, how on earth would i ever need to worry about ammo on a hunt???

My selection would be 257 Roberts, and 7mm Rem Mag.
Nothing on the North American contenent i couldn't/wouldn't hunt with those.

 

[shootbrownelk]

25.06 and 375H&H. That will make you 100% covered.

I have a .243 and a .375H&H That'd be my choices.

 

[choc dogs]

two guns. Blasphemy.

 

[GlockZ]

my only problem with the 300wsm is the finicky feeding issue, it is a fantastic caliber none the less, but i'd go with a 243 and a 30-06. the 30-06 has went and done everything and availability of ammo is astounding, same with the 243.

 

[VAspeedgoat]

I'm interested to see the comments you might have for this. Howa and I have been working on a project somewhat similar. We are trying to find a combination of cartridge, weight, length, barrel taper, etc that will be the most versatile option for the western hunter who is only going to buy one rifle, possibly two.

Right now I have these rifles we are working with for the test, along with the ammo choices I am using based on past experience with these cartridges. All have H-S Precision stocks and are topped with Leupold VX-5 or VX-6 scopes.

6.5 CM 22" barrel - 129 grain Nosler AccuBond Long Range

.270 Win 22" barrel - 130 grain Nosler AccuBond

7mm-.08 22" barrel - 140 grain Nosler E-Tip and 140 grain Nosler Accubond

.308 Win 22" barrel - 165 grain Nosler Partition and 168 grain Nosler E-Tip

.308 Win 26" barrel - - 165 grain Nosler Partition and 168 grain Nosler E-Tip

.300 Win Mag 24" barrel - 180 grain Nosler AccuBond

.300 Win Mag 26" barrel - 180 grain Nosler E-Tip


I'm finding the hard part is to find the balance of weight versus cost. Even the lightest of these is more weight than my Alpine Mountain Rifles. But, the cost is significantly lower. Some are willing to pay that higher cost, some are not.

All are cerakoted, which is a pretty low additional cost for the weather-deterring benefits. All have come with factory trigger settings at 2.75#. Not sure if that will be allowed in a retail rifle, due to liability concerns, but the Howa trigger is a really good trigger and even "gooder" when set below 3.0#.

With no compromise for accuracy, the traits we are trying to balance are performance for the widest array of western hunting, cost, weight, ammo availability, durability, and low maintenance. It is turning out to be a harder project than I expected, given how many different situations we hunt in and how many different species we pursue.

Interested to continue following the discussion. Thanks to the original poster for starting this topic.

So far the leader is the 7mm-.08 as the all-around versatile cartridge, but I fear my past biases is influencing that decision. We'll see if that changes when we start in the heavy part of our elk hunting calendar.

We did a poll a few years ago and the .270 won. I think 30-06 was second followed by .308, 7-08, .300 win mag, 7 mag in some sort of order. I'm surprised that 30-06 isn't on the list of those your trying as well as a 7 mag.

 

[NoWiser]

If I could have 2, they’d by a .260 and a .300 Win Mag. Basically the same as your two choices.

I only have one rifle, and it will likely stay that way for the foreseeable future. I’m not afraid to hunt anything with my .270 WSM and 130 grain ttsx handloads. I’ve cleanly killed everything from wolves and antelope to moose with that gun and never second guessed my caliber choice (at least since switching to copper.)

 

[Beanland_fan]

I’ve owned multiple Kimbers and eventually realized the Montana - specifically the 84M and 84L - are too light for me. My first rifle was a very accurate classic 8400 in 7WSM. That was going to be my one do it all rifle. Then I realized it was too much for whitetails in KY. (Like a fool I sold it)

If you’re going with the Kimber, you also need to consider how their throats and twist rates.

The 6.5 creedmoor is an 8 twist, the 260 is 9 twist and the 243 is a 10 twist - advantage creedmoor.

The 280AI kicks like a mule in the Montana. But at 6 lbs 2 oz bare, it is a very powerful lightweight mountain rifle.

The 8400 WSM stock does soak up recoil very well, similar to the 84M. However, their best combo rifle was the 7WSM, which is not a mainstream chambering.

So for a two Kimber rifle battery, the 6.5 creedmoor/300 WSM combo would be hard to beat.

Or, a 223 and 30-06.

 

[spinal tap]

Having now browsed the specs and cartridge choices of the Mountain Ascent, per the OP’s parameters, and assuming that's the only BHA choice, I’m going to alter my first selection and say 6.5 CM and .30-‘06 rather than a .300 for a couple of reasons. One reason being is that the Mountain Ascent is awfully dang light for a magnum at 5 lbs and I just don’t personally care for that much recoil in a light rifle. A 200gr .30-‘06 is the heaviest I’d want to go with it.

Another reason that I think hasn’t been discussed is that as more and more folks are choosing to hunt with silencers (as I do), I would likely cut the lighter weight cartridge's barrel down to 18-20” for threading. While I appreciate the Mountain Ascent having a muzzle adapter available for silencer use at 22", I would rather not deal with the possibility of losing it, cross-threading it in a hurry, getting it stuck on the rifle or in the can, etc. I'd rather give up a little velocity with a shorter barrel and the harmonics and heat can get wonky with longer, thinner barrel profiles and cans. A direct thread 1/2x28 or 5/8x24 muzzle would be my ideal. Thus, I’d prefer having a suppressed 6.5 Creedmoor/Man Bun/Yoga Pants and an unsuppresssd .30-‘06 Springfield at hand with its load versatility should I need it somewhere that silencers are taboo. I think 7mm-08 in the lighter cartridge rifle would be a fine choice, too. FWIW in regard to cutting barrels, I’m losing 200 FPS off the factory standard of 24” with my 6.5 CM rifle at 20". At 2500 FPS with a 143gr bullet, I can live with that loss inside 500 yards.

Big Fin - thank you for your comments in this thread. I would really enjoy reading more about your testing experiences with the Howa prototypes. My personal suggestion, if worthy of consideration, is that Howa consider more factory threaded muzzle options in lighter barrel profiles - like a #2 profile 18 or 20 inch short action threaded at the muzzle for 1/2x28 or 5/8x24. 5/8x24 would be certainly be more versatile for .30 cal cans, esp if they could put a little more shoulder on it like the Barrett Fieldcraft, but 1/2x28 could work. Even a #4 profile would be on my short list of consideration if the unscoped rifle weight could be kept around 7 lbs. Not sure if that's possible with a #4 18-20" barrel, however. I see Howa offers the HS semi-heavy with a threaded #4 barrel at 26", but that weight and length with the addition of a can may lead to fatigue, inconvenience and even mockery in the field, e.g. "Nice punt gun!"

 

[jeffraines]

If I went to a two gun battery I’d go 22 and 30-06/300 mag depending on large bears. If no large bears, I’d stick with the 06.

 

[Dan O]

I'm interested to see the comments you might have for this. Howa and I have been working on a project somewhat similar. We are trying to find a combination of cartridge, weight, length, barrel taper, etc that will be the most versatile option for the western hunter who is only going to buy one rifle, possibly two.

Right now I have these rifles we are working with for the test, along with the ammo choices I am using based on past experience with these cartridges. All have H-S Precision stocks and are topped with Leupold VX-5 or VX-6 scopes.

6.5 CM 22" barrel - 129 grain Nosler AccuBond Long Range

.270 Win 22" barrel - 130 grain Nosler AccuBond

7mm-.08 22" barrel - 140 grain Nosler E-Tip and 140 grain Nosler Accubond

.308 Win 22" barrel - 165 grain Nosler Partition and 168 grain Nosler E-Tip

.308 Win 26" barrel - - 165 grain Nosler Partition and 168 grain Nosler E-Tip

.300 Win Mag 24" barrel - 180 grain Nosler AccuBond

.300 Win Mag 26" barrel - 180 grain Nosler E-Tip


I'm finding the hard part is to find the balance of weight versus cost. Even the lightest of these is more weight than my Alpine Mountain Rifles. But, the cost is significantly lower. Some are willing to pay that higher cost, some are not.

All are cerakoted, which is a pretty low additional cost for the weather-deterring benefits. All have come with factory trigger settings at 2.75#. Not sure if that will be allowed in a retail rifle, due to liability concerns, but the Howa trigger is a really good trigger and even "gooder" when set below 3.0#.

With no compromise for accuracy, the traits we are trying to balance are performance for the widest array of western hunting, cost, weight, ammo availability, durability, and low maintenance. It is turning out to be a harder project than I expected, given how many different situations we hunt in and how many different species we pursue.

Interested to continue following the discussion. Thanks to the original poster for starting this topic.

So far the leader is the 7mm-.08 as the all-around versatile cartridge, but I fear my past biases is influencing that decision. We'll see if that changes when we start in the heavy part of our elk hunting calendar.

Sounds like you have a fun project to work on. It would be interesting if you could give the weight of the rifle before being scoped. Also what the velocity difference is between the various barrel lengths. I would suspect the 300 wm 24 vs 26 would be small but the 308 my be a different story but a chronograph would answer that question. For the short action model I think it's a toss up between the 7mm HT and the 308. The 6.5 Creedmoor is good but I think over rated giving it mystical powers LOL. For the long action the 270 should have a 24 inch barrel, just personal opinion. Maybe giving the 7mm Mag as an option would be a good idea. I've never owned one but many have and love them. Maybe some day I'll get one for myself.


Dan

 

[TX_Eric]

I picked up a 6.5 creedmoor last year to be a back up gun to my 7rm that is currently a paperweight. Picked up a tikka in 300wsm this year. I feel confident I could hunt anything I would ever care to at any reasonable distance with those two calibers.

 

[7Remmy]

6.5 Creed / 280 AI. My 280 AI rocks bullets from 140 to 160 grains. The stand outs being the 140 TTSX and 160 Partition. Get the load work done,load up a couple boxes,and go slay things. The Creedmoor would be the recreational shooter. Factory or hand loaded. Fun little round. The one we have here loves cheap factory fodder. What's not to like.

 

[Straight Arrow]

I have hunted with 25-06 100 grain bullet for antelope and 7 mm Rem mag 150 or 160 grain for deer and elk for several decades, with proven effectiveness. However, recently my grandson rifle is the 7mm-08 140 grain and I am really impressed with it. If I were to select one rifle for all three species, it would be the 7mm-08.