Badlandcat
Active member
The good, bad and ugly. Have 16 points, thinking of trying for unit 1.
Thanks for any pointers.
Thanks for any pointers.
Wyo Moose unit 1
- Thread starter Badlandcat
- Start date
Topgun 30-06
Active member
IF you can draw the tag it's a very good unit with some nice bulls and they aren't fighting for survival due to wolves and grizzlies like a lot of the units on the west side of the state. The Burgess Junction area where highways 14 and 14A split is a very good place to start.
BuzzH
Well-known member
That's a gross over-simplification and largely not true about whats going on with moose in Western Wyoming.
For starters, there are some major habitat issues that are causing all sorts of problems with moose in Western Wyoming and really state wide.
I'm on the WGBLC moose committee and have been involved with funding a bunch of research that is on-going with moose.
One of the major studies is looking at Elaeophora Schneideri infection rates in moose. If you do a google search on carotid artery worm, or the like, you will find lots of information about prevalence and why its increasing in moose. Some early data is suggesting that infection rates vary from herd to herd, and is even a problem in areas where moose habitat is in good condition.
What's most troubling is that moose of any age can literally just drop dead from this problem. I've found 3 dead moose in the last few years in Western Wyoming and SE Idaho that are 100% victims of this. Usually, they tend to die in or near water, which I have found to be the case in the 3 I have found. In all 3 cases there were NO signs of predation at all, and all 3 moose looked to be in good physical condition. Also, all 3 were found in late summer/early fall, hardly a time when healthy moose just drop over dead.
Also, I've seen symptoms in several cow moose in the Snowy Range near Laramie. You will see moose with very short ears, or ears that have been frost bitten off. This is almost always due to loss of blood flow to extremities because of the carotid artery blockage. I have pictures of moose with this condition.
Back to the habitat issues. The moose committee also funded a fecundity study. That study is looking at pregnancy rates, cow body fat, and how the habitat all relates to cow/calf ratios as well as calf survival.
All of this is pointing to habitat, disease, and higher average temperatures having more of an impact on moose than predation.
Predation is not the main reason that moose are not doing well across the mid-west and West...simply not the case.
But, on the bright side in Wyoming, the Western side of Wyoming is showing some improvements in both habitat and moose numbers, in particular the Sublette herd. Some large wildfires in the area, habitat improvements, etc. have resulted in some herd recovery.
From the emerging research in Wyoming, and as we move forward with potential solutions, that moose populations will recover. About 85% of that recovery is going to happen by improving habitat.
Not really too sure how, or if, there is a solution to the E.S. (carotid artery worm).
But, to simplify the moose issue as a predation problem is a joke. Makes great bar-stool biology talk, but is far from the reality of what's causing the problem. The science and biology is not pointing that direction at all.
Oh, and don't count out the west side units as not having good moose hunts...rumor has it there are still some good numbers and moose to be found:
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Topgun 30-06
Active member
Thank you for your unnecessary dissertation on moose that wasn't asked for by the OP. I'm fully aware of all the problems that moose have and my statement was not an oversimplification, but just a generalized statement that the BigHorns population has two less predator problems to deal with than animals over on the west side of the state. Also, thank you for posting the two moose pictures, as I guess most of the site members don't know what they look like, LOL! I'm also looking forward to a moose hunt this fall on the west side of the state, since my buddy in Sheridan should draw his tag this year and I'll be helping him on the hunt.
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MinnesotaHunter
Well-known member
Buzz, are you familiar with this group?
http://arterialwormandmoose.blogspot.com/
There are some interesting parallels between the brain worm affecting the Great Lakes herds and this worm affecting the Shiras. Moose in close proximity with livestock and deer seems like a bad combo.
http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/mcvmagazine/issues/2015/sep-oct/moose-in-minnesota.html
http://arterialwormandmoose.blogspot.com/
There are some interesting parallels between the brain worm affecting the Great Lakes herds and this worm affecting the Shiras. Moose in close proximity with livestock and deer seems like a bad combo.
http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/mcvmagazine/issues/2015/sep-oct/moose-in-minnesota.html
BuzzH
Well-known member
The OP is deserving of facts when spending 16 moose points he has invested a lot of time and money in.
To discount other options in very good units because of Michigans version of bar-stool biology talk...isn't going to help.
Facts matter and your opinion is trumped by the real facts of what is happening.
To discount other options in very good units because of Michigans version of bar-stool biology talk...isn't going to help.
Facts matter and your opinion is trumped by the real facts of what is happening.
BuzzH
Well-known member
MH, yes I have seen the first link, but not the second.. Thank you for adding to this discussion in a positive way.
There are real issues with moose and I'm hoping that, through research, some solutions can be found.
This really hit the radar the first year I was on the Moose Committee and opened my eyes to the many problems facing moose.
We are funding a lot of research, and that's a good thing.
MinnesotaHunter
Well-known member
I looked briefly, but never found the results of their study.
The second link is really focused on NE MN moose, so may not be as relevant to the OP. The historical information on the herd was most interesting to me, particularly ebb and flow of species in an area and how they interact. Moose is certainly a complex issue here in MN. Parasites, Wolves, and Habitat.....
16 points in WY can get you a pretty awesome moose tag. Lots to consider. That being said I have seen a fair number of moose in area 1. I think a lot of people gravitate to that area along 14, as the highway runs right through some pretty decent moose habitat, and they are pretty visible from the road....
Topgun 30-06
Active member
So what friggin facts did you give him on what units to hunt, LOL! Have you hunted unit 1 to make any recommendations or are you just bloviating again like you normally do when I try to help someone? I sure didn't see ANY comments from you about the unit he asked about. Maybe I know a little bit more about that particular unit than you do on numbers and trophy potential! It's simple to see you're being a DB again because I didn't tell him not to look into other units. He asked about unit 1 and that's what I posted about. Take your BS some place else and knock off your condescending crap like you seem to post the majority of the time!
Hey guys, keep it to the question the original poster asked. The back and forth personal stuff adds no value.
On a positive note....it may be interesting to compare what's going on in Wyo compared to Colo with moose? Just about every year the CPW has opened new units to moose hunting in Colo. Currently the moose population in Colo is expanding and increasing by leaps and bounds. There are no wolves/grizz to deal with and moose habitat is in a fairly "prestine" state. It may be interesting to know whether the parasite problem exists in Colo and if the parasite is as much a problem as in Wyo where habitat and other factors are possibly different?
In regard to unit 1. I harvested a super bull there a few years ago. If anyone has any questions I would be glad to offer advice. As mentioned above there aren't grizz in unit 1. Camping in grizz country is not much fun which is a definite disadvantage. I would also say that the number and quality of bulls in units with grizz/wolves isn't like it was 20 years ago. The B&C books don't lie and there are a fraction of book bulls harvested in Teton County than 10 to 30 years ago. Obviously the decline in the quality and quantity of moose is a combo of many factors habitat, predators, disease, winters, etc. so it is impossible to just point the finger at just one factor! That's not to say that there aren't tremendous bulls available in grizz/wolf country...but there certainly aren't B&C bulls available like they were many years ago. Teton County used to be the premier location in Wyo to potentially harvest B&C bulls...but it can be pretty tough in recent years. The genetics are definitely still there but habitat, wolves/grizz, parasites, etc don't help.
In regard to unit 1. I harvested a super bull there a few years ago. If anyone has any questions I would be glad to offer advice. As mentioned above there aren't grizz in unit 1. Camping in grizz country is not much fun which is a definite disadvantage. I would also say that the number and quality of bulls in units with grizz/wolves isn't like it was 20 years ago. The B&C books don't lie and there are a fraction of book bulls harvested in Teton County than 10 to 30 years ago. Obviously the decline in the quality and quantity of moose is a combo of many factors habitat, predators, disease, winters, etc. so it is impossible to just point the finger at just one factor! That's not to say that there aren't tremendous bulls available in grizz/wolf country...but there certainly aren't B&C bulls available like they were many years ago. Teton County used to be the premier location in Wyo to potentially harvest B&C bulls...but it can be pretty tough in recent years. The genetics are definitely still there but habitat, wolves/grizz, parasites, etc don't help.
shootbrownelk
Well-known member
Badlandcat, check-out Moose area 38/41 in the Snowies, west of Laramie. I hunted there last fall for a cow moose. I saw some monster bulls down there, no wolves, no grizzlies. Call the Laramie G&F office. The folks there will help you out. I talked to several wardens and they all said that 38/41 had the best trophy potential in the state, and from what I saw I believe them.
BuzzH
Well-known member
Not happening with 16 points...but its a great tag if you have the points.
Moose are not tough to find in that unit.
Moose are not tough to find in that unit.
Badlandcat
Active member
Went with unit 1. 38 is a great unit, but you need 18+ points. Also 1 is half the driving distance as 38 for me. Even with 16 points 1 is not a for sure tag, lots of people have been cashing points in the last couple years.
BuzzH
Well-known member
Is the 90/10 allocation going to come up again? (Dumb question, right?)
BuzzH
Well-known member
Yes, and even if it doesn't NR are not assured a single moose, sheep, goat, or bison tag via any statute or regulation.
You call that consideration
Wait for it..................Don't answer, I should not have even stirred this in respect for Randy's request I just read.
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