To crimp or not to crimp?

[Luke_with_a_lab]

Hey all,

Im looking to order a die set for my 6.5 PRC. There are a ton of them out there, some with crimp and some without. When reading it seems like some people like to crimp and some dont for various applications/ reason. Being that Im a complete Noob at reloading I'm simply trying to avoid as many mistakes as possible I would appreciate any and all advice you might have to offer. If anyone die set they recommend, I would be all ears. Also these days is it foolish not to go with a carbide set?

I am also working on getting everything I need to reload for 300 Win Mag. I already have the carbide rifle die set from Dillon for that and that includes a crimp die. Should I use the crimp die since I have it?

 

[Seamaster]

I only crimp the heavy recoiling cartridges (375's and larger), pistol cartridges, and the 22 Hornet. The remainder do better with no crimp. I have been a fairly serious benchrest shooter/competitor for the past 50 years or so, and there are good reasons that none of us crimp.

Factory cartridges that are produced on high speed machines normally crimp. Of course there are always going to be some internet dudes that believe in crimping everything, and some that swear they have seen bigfoot.

 

[VikingsGuy]

I only crimp for pistol and 30-30Win lever action.

 

[Redman]

Anything that goes through a semiautomatic, pistol, and heavy recoil guns I crimp.

 

[brocksw]

Pistol and 5.56 rounds are the only thing I crimp.

 

[BackofBeyond]

I crimp .44 mag and .30-30. Just bought a Lee FC die for my .300 PRC to see if it makes any difference with Hammer bullets. Just to experiment.

 

[Luke_with_a_lab]

Good deal, thanks for the responses

 

[Redmt]

Light crimp with Lee crimp die on .223, 6.5 .30 Cal. The problems I fight are limited magazine length being shorter than desired seating depth. I'm always trying to load a bullet that's a little too long in the magazine.

 

[Benfromalbuquerque]

I think you should crimp everything all of the time. Not excessively, just enough. And anneal every several loadings too. Or not, you could also skip all of this like I did and figure out that way why others do these things.

 

[Sako'06]

I like the Lee factory crimp die and a light crimp. Another handloader I spoke with recently commented that he feels the factory crimp die helps reduce runout.

Sounds plausible and I'd like to measure this however I don't have a runout gauge.

 

[WapitiBob]

I crimped some hammers and it was a pain in the ass; bullet moved in or out depending on it's mood. Went to .0035 neck tension and haven't thought about crimping since.

 

[Robert N]

Roll Crimp for revolver loads, mild taper crimp for straight wall pistol. Gentlest crimp possible (round off the edge for feeding) for rifle, including .375 H&H.

 

[nhenry]

I crimp with Hammers in my 280AI. Proves to be more consistent than without.

 

[Don Fischer]

Hey all,

Im looking to order a die set for my 6.5 PRC. There are a ton of them out there, some with crimp and some without. When reading it seems like some people like to crimp and some dont for various applications/ reason. Being that Im a complete Noob at reloading I'm simply trying to avoid as many mistakes as possible I would appreciate any and all advice you might have to offer. If anyone die set they recommend, I would be all ears. Also these days is it foolish not to go with a carbide set?

I am also working on getting everything I need to reload for 300 Win Mag. I already have the carbide rifle die set from Dillon for that and that includes a crimp die. Should I use the crimp die since I have it?

Foolish not to go with carbide? Why is that? I have been reloading for over 55yrs, about, now and have never felt a need for them. They do the same thing as steel dies without lube as I understnd it!

 

[Don Fischer]

I think you should crimp everything all of the time. Not excessively, just enough. And anneal every several loadings too. Or not, you could also skip all of this like I did and figure out that way why others do these things.

I don't doubt crimping everything will hurt anything. But, other than handguns and shotgun shells I see it simply as an unnessary step. I don't shoot heavy recoil rifles. In hand guns and heavy recoil rifle's my understanding is it keeps the bullet from moving under recoil!

 

[Benfromalbuquerque]

@Don Fischer sir, you’ve got more years reloading than I’ve been alive. I humbly offer only my experience and that is tightened groups. I’m no benchrest pro and would never think 700yds ethical for big game. Minute of deer is fine, but it just feels good when I roll my own and get sub inch or even sub .5.

 

[Don Fischer]

Hey all,

Im looking to order a die set for my 6.5 PRC. There are a ton of them out there, some with crimp and some without. When reading it seems like some people like to crimp and some dont for various applications/ reason. Being that Im a complete Noob at reloading I'm simply trying to avoid as many mistakes as possible I would appreciate any and all advice you might have to offer. If anyone die set they recommend, I would be all ears. Also these days is it foolish not to go with a carbide set?

I am also working on getting everything I need to reload for 300 Win Mag. I already have the carbide rifle die set from Dillon for that and that includes a crimp die. Should I use the crimp die since I have it?

Speaking of die set's, each set for any particular cartridge should return the case to Sammi spects no matter what the die is made out of. I hear a lot about the junk Lee put's out quite a bit. Well I have some Lee tools and they are as good as any other tools, speaking of die's. The difference between steel and carbide dies as I understand it is you don't need to lube the case with carbide! The ability to make a load more accurate falls on the shoulder's of the guy doing the handloading! Adding a crimp to most cartridges seldom does anything other than hold a bullet in place in the case. I crimp all my handgun case's because that is the way I learned to do it. I don't really know if it necessary but doing it hasn't caused me a problem over the years. In rifles the way I learned it was to crimp ammo for lever action tube feed rifles. The claim was always that under recoil the bullet could be pushed into the case deeper. Theory is that in tube feed rifles the bullet of the round is resting on the base of the case in frome ot it and under recoil the case in front is forced back against the bullet behind it. Sounds like crimping is a good idea. I'd suspect if the cartridge had enough recoil the same might happen in magazine fed rifles from recoil. But thinking back, I've had two 338 mag's and never crimped a bullet in them. Seemed like a lot of recoil to me but then they are the biggest cartridges I've ever fired. Does crimping really hold the bullet in place under recoil? Well in my experience, I think sometimes. In handguns it seems that crimping in the bullet also brings the load up the pressure. Leave off the crimp and pressure goes down. Well I have nothing to measure pressure with so I don't really know but If it does, seems to work in my loads and if it doesn't, I haven't a clue! If you follow the direction in the loading manual it pretty hard to go wrong. But doing things beyond that should be done with care. Brings up something else. I have never crimped a rifle cartridge but one of the reasons for crimping handgun cartridges it to bring the load up to pressure. Wonder if it also raise's rifle cartridge pressure if you crimp them? I would have to guess that if it does a handgun cartridge then it does a rifle also, to what degree I haven't a clue!

I have a number of different die sets from different manufacturer's. I can only find two difference's in any ot them. First is the finish and second is the cost. Other than that every set sizes the same when used according to directions!

 

[Luke_with_a_lab]

Speaking of die set's, each set for any particular cartridge should return the case to Sammi spects no matter what the die is made out of. I hear a lot about the junk Lee put's out quite a bit. Well I have some Lee tools and they are as good as any other tools, speaking of die's. The difference between steel and carbide dies as I understand it is you don't need to lube the case with carbide! The ability to make a load more accurate falls on the shoulder's of the guy doing the handloading! Adding a crimp to most cartridges seldom does anything other than hold a bullet in place in the case. I crimp all my handgun case's because that is the way I learned to do it. I don't really know if it necessary but doing it hasn't caused me a problem over the years. In rifles the way I learned it was to crimp ammo for lever action tube feed rifles. The claim was always that under recoil the bullet could be pushed into the case deeper. Theory is that in tube feed rifles the bullet of the round is resting on the base of the case in frome ot it and under recoil the case in front is forced back against the bullet behind it. Sounds like crimping is a good idea. I'd suspect if the cartridge had enough recoil the same might happen in magazine fed rifles from recoil. But thinking back, I've had two 338 mag's and never crimped a bullet in them. Seemed like a lot of recoil to me but then they are the biggest cartridges I've ever fired. Does crimping really hold the bullet in place under recoil? Well in my experience, I think sometimes. In handguns it seems that crimping in the bullet also brings the load up the pressure. Leave off the crimp and pressure goes down. Well I have nothing to measure pressure with so I don't really know but If it does, seems to work in my loads and if it doesn't, I haven't a clue! If you follow the direction in the loading manual it pretty hard to go wrong. But doing things beyond that should be done with care. Brings up something else. I have never crimped a rifle cartridge but one of the reasons for crimping handgun cartridges it to bring the load up to pressure. Wonder if it also raise's rifle cartridge pressure if you crimp them? I would have to guess that if it does a handgun cartridge then it does a rifle also, to what degree I haven't a clue!

I have a number of different die sets from different manufacturer's. I can only find two difference's in any ot them. First is the finish and second is the cost. Other than that every set sizes the same when used according to directions!

Wow lots of good info, thanks a ton. For dies I'm sure leaning towards the carbide because as you said, it appears you do not need to lube the case. If so, why not go carbide and eliminate one step? I guess time will tell on that one. Also thanks for the info on the crimping. Being that im going to reload 6.5prc and 300 win Im thinking I will try without a crimp first. It seems like thats what the majority of the input here recommends.

On a separate note, dear god getting everything a person needs to actually reload is expensive. I've been slowly getting all the equipment over the last two years and finally have about everything needed.

 

[Benfromalbuquerque]

Wow lots of good info, thanks a ton. For dies I'm sure leaning towards the carbide because as you said, it appears you do not need to lube the case. If so, why not go carbide and eliminate one step? I guess time will tell on that one. Also thanks for the info on the crimping. Being that im going to reload 6.5prc and 300 win Im thinking I will try without a crimp first. It seems like thats what the majority of the input here recommends.

On a separate note, dear god getting everything a person needs to actually reload is expensive. I've been slowly getting all the equipment over the last two years and finally have about everything needed.

It’s a hobby that we enjoy and cost is limited to how far you want to take it. I consider home brewing analogous to reloading. As in a guy could buy a Mr. Beer kit (Lee Loader) and get basically everything to make a gallon of horse piss. It’s alright, could be better.

Alternatively, same guy can get a propane burner, deep stock tank, 5,6,8gal glass car boys, buy whole grain mash, books, geek out at home brew classes…

 

[std7mag]

The carbide dies are more for straight walled cartridges.
I haven't run accross one for bottle necked cartridges as of yet.
I use crimp for pistol cartridges, and semi auto/pump/lever action rifles.
Not for bolt action, with a couple of caveats.

I've seen where a crimp has helped accuracy for mono bullets if your having accuracy issues.

I'm trying a crimp on 2 rifles i use for benchrest matches. I'm wanting to see if i can get my wifes 223 more consistant.
But...
All the necks have been trimmed to equal length, and OD neck turned.
Without those 2 things, there is no way to guarantee a consistant crimp.