Sigh-ting in issues

[David58]

Is this a new scope? What model is it? Sounds like it may be an issue with the scope not holding zero. How tight did you torque the ring caps to?

Also it wouldn’t take much time at all the remove the barreled action and sand the barrel channel for some clearance. Use an appropriate size deep well socket wrapped in sandpaper and keep working at it.

Lastly I’d try some of the 165gr ammo you have and see if it groups any better. Some rifles just don’t like some ammo.

My plan is now to remove the barrel and action and remove some wood, to at least make sure the fore end makes no contact. We had a very wet summer here, so it is possible the wood in the forestock "grew". Will sand it down to remove pressure points, put some oil on the raw wood to seal it, reassemble, then head out to the range.

I am pretty well destined to use the 165 - all the decent hand loads I have are 165 gr, and I have a handful of boxes of factory with that weight. Going to be interesting to see how this turns out, sure needs to work as I have few options - my wife's 7mm-08 is a bit short for me...

 

[JLS]

Some rifles come with a pressure point under the barrel in lieu of free floating.

If the 7-08 shots well, take it. A short stock isn’t that hard to overcome.

 

[howl]

If the 7mm08 is gtg just put a slip on recoil pad on it to increase the length of pull. Where we start our deer season in tshirts and end it bundled up that's a successful strategy.

I think your scope was jacked by having rings out of order the first time it was mounted. New scope mounted properly in lapped in rings would be the course.

Recommend spray clear to seal the inside of the stock. Oil won't do it. A heavy coat of paste wax on the metal will protect it long term

 

[cahunter805]

My plan is now to remove the barrel and action and remove some wood, to at least make sure the fore end makes no contact. We had a very wet summer here, so it is possible the wood in the forestock "grew". Will sand it down to remove pressure points, put some oil on the raw wood to seal it, reassemble, then head out to the range.

I am pretty well destined to use the 165 - all the decent hand loads I have are 165 gr, and I have a handful of boxes of factory with that weight. Going to be interesting to see how this turns out, sure needs to work as I have few options - my wife's 7mm-08 is a bit short for me...

Nothing wrong with a 165gr bullet in a 30-06. It will get the job done no doubt.

 

[std7mag]

I'd watch before "taking wood out of the barrel channel"!
The Ruger 77s are made to have that contact point!

"Any attempt to remove the contact point removes ANY accuracy warranty".
That from Ruger.

There is something wrong in either your rings, or scope.

Don't look for problems that aren't there & creating more problems that you didn't have to begin with.

 

[44hunter45]

I'd watch before "taking wood out of the barrel channel"!
The Ruger 77s are made to have that contact point!

"Any attempt to remove the contact point removes ANY accuracy warranty".
That from Ruger.

There is something wrong in either your rings, or scope.

Don't look for problems that aren't there & creating more problems that you didn't have to begin with.

I've read that too. But both my M77's are floated and bedded. They shoot MOA dirty or clean - all day. The old tang safety .30-06 even has a pitted bore and still does it.
Either way, these are not changes you make in August or September.

This still sounds like everything BUT a rifle problem.

To test for gimbal problems you run a box test. Set 12 clicks up & 12 right shoot two rounds, 24 left shoot two rounds , 24 down shoot two rounds, 24 right shoot two rounds, 12 up 12 left shoot two rounds. You should see the points of impact make a square pattern around your starting zero, then come back in to your zero point.

It's time for pictures. Please post some pic of the mounted scope from the top and side views. We need to see both rings in close, and a view of the whole scope in relation to the action.

 

[Doublegunner]

Scope is solid, everything torqued to spec. Looking at your rate of firing, I am shooting far more rounds than you in that time span. I am going to see if I am dealing with copper fouling when I clean the rifle today, just to eliminate any influence there. Then when I head to the range I will put myself on a timer and not shoot any faster than one shot every 6 or 7 minutes, or whatever it takes to have a cool barrel for each shot. I'll tote my .223 out to plink with in between - having a second gun is a good idea, will keep my hands busy.

Copper buildup can be a killer. I have a remington 270 that is very accurate until the copper builds up. I clean it out and then back to. 5 inch groups. As for rate of fire go 3 min between shots and see what that does. I have found that works about right even for my thinnest barrels. I disagree with those who say the m77 is not accurate. Mine shoots well under an inch with most loads and is very consistent. My fathers is also very accurate. I also disagree with those who say the 30-06 is not that accurate. I currently own 4 and they all shoot well under sub moa. Like any rifle you just have to find the loads they like.

 

[Doublegunner]

I understand the wanting to clean, really i do.

But...

I've cleaned my Rugers of all the copper before. Groups opened up.
Took about 20 rounds before they tightened up again.
Some barrels just like some copper in them.
Don't know any other way to explain it.
Now i just clean the carbon, leave the copper.

I agree with this. Some rifles do better with copper others not so much.

 

[std7mag]

So, what's the prognosis, Doctor?

 

[shannerdrake]

Yes, I'm also curious where this ended up.

Everything has already been said here, but I will add that I've seen plenty of ammo (and plenty of shooters) that perform well at 100, but not so at 200. I've also seen the opposite. My current western setup is a Vanguard 300win and I shoot Barnes 165. They barely hold 1MO at 100, but consistently run close to .5MOA at 200.

 

[Bigforky]

I understand the wanting to clean, really i do.

But...

I've cleaned my Rugers of all the copper before. Groups opened up.
Took about 20 rounds before they tightened up again.
Some barrels just like some copper in them.
Don't know any other way to explain it.
Now i just clean the carbon, leave the copper.

Might sound bad but I don’t clean mine but every 5-700 rounds. Then like you said takes another 20-30 to foul the barrel again snd get my groups to come back

 

[Huntingchic2020]

I was missing the target by inches everytime but always to the left. My husband put in a laser sight and the gun was off target by a lot. However I am still missing to the left but I think it's because I jerk at the last second, or pull the trigger to fast. But at least I am hitting the target.

 

[Durango Mike]

I get what you're saying, but the scope is on my '06. May go ahead and try moving it to the Savage 99, but have to see how the scope would fit and confirm the 1" tube on the old scope. I hate changing mid-stream, but I don't think I have the time to free the barrel from stock contact, properly bed the action, and sight in - especially given my ammo situation. I guess if ammo weren't $80+ a box for '06 right now....

Will be giving the swap a closer look tomorrow. Doubt I will see MOA with the 99, but MOE will work in elk season. Right now I am barely minute of barn door.

Crap. Didn't want to be learning this kind of stuff this soon before a trip....sure thought I had it working before, but better to find out now than lose a wounded critter. May lose some sleep by the time this is over, a $1000 tag will do that to you.

If you are close to SW Colorado i have plenty of 30-06 brass / bullets /powder if you need some help there. I have messed with Ruger 77 for a friend and have a scout rifle in 308. not a big fan of the bedding setup they use unless it is glass bedded.

 

[cahunter805]

I was missing the target by inches everytime but always to the left. My husband put in a laser sight and the gun was off target by a lot. However I am still missing to the left but I think it's because I jerk at the last second, or pull the trigger to fast. But at least I am hitting the target.

Practice dry firing your rifle with your eyes closed and a steady squeeze of the trigger. Do this every night at least 20-30 times until you become more comfortable with the rifle. Then go to the shooting range and see how you are shooting then.
Also be sure to keep a good cheek weld and always try to locate your shot on the target through your scope. Don’t pull your head to look.

 

[std7mag]

If you are close to SW Colorado i have plenty of 30-06 brass / bullets /powder if you need some help there. I have messed with Ruger 77 for a friend and have a scout rifle in 308. not a big fan of the bedding setup they use unless it is glass bedded.

I gave up on glass bedding.
Both forms of Acraglass were too soft.
I use Devcon now.

 

[David658]

Yes, I'm also curious where this ended up.

Everything has already been said here, but I will add that I've seen plenty of ammo (and plenty of shooters) that perform well at 100, but not so at 200. I've also seen the opposite. My current western setup is a Vanguard 300win and I shoot Barnes 165. They barely hold 1MO at 100, but consistently run close to .5MOA at 200.

Well, where it has ended up is that I sanded the barrel channel a bit to make sure that there is no contact along the sides/bottom of the barrel except at the nose of the forestock, on the bottom of the barrel. I will give it a go at 100, and will set a 200 target on the off-chance that I am on at 100. It is very possible that the solution is bedding the action, etc, or simply buying a Ruger American and moving my scope to that.

For the hunt in three weeks, if the M77 isn't going to play, I will use my wife's 7mm-08. I actually have eight boxes of ammo for it - probably worth more than my 401k. I can shoot it fine at 200 - it's a bit short, but I can make it work, almost every rifle is too short for me except for my customer front stuffers.

I really want this Ruger 77 to work - it was a gift from my father-in-law, with obvious sentimental value attached. But gunsmiths are far and few between in these parts, and I might well just punt to the Ruger American (or equivalent) after the elk hunt and before the Ibex hunt in February.

Range report tomorrow afternoon - I plan to pull the trigger on the first round at 0800 tomorrow.

 

[p_ham]

I gave up on glass bedding.
Both forms of Acraglass were too soft.
I use Devcon now.

I like Devcon. I used Marine Tex on the last couple. I like that too.

 

[elkchsr1]

Well, where it has ended up is that I sanded the barrel channel a bit to make sure that there is no contact along the sides/bottom of the barrel except at the nose of the forestock, on the bottom of the barrel. I will give it a go at 100, and will set a 200 target on the off-chance that I am on at 100. It is very possible that the solution is bedding the action, etc, or simply buying a Ruger American and moving my scope to that.

For the hunt in three weeks, if the M77 isn't going to play, I will use my wife's 7mm-08. I actually have eight boxes of ammo for it - probably worth more than my 401k. I can shoot it fine at 200 - it's a bit short, but I can make it work, almost every rifle is too short for me except for my customer front stuffers.

I really want this Ruger 77 to work - it was a gift from my father-in-law, with obvious sentimental value attached. But gunsmiths are far and few between in these parts, and I might well just punt to the Ruger American (or equivalent) after the elk hunt and before the Ibex hunt in February.

Range report tomorrow afternoon - I plan to pull the trigger on the first round at 0800 tomorrow.

It sounds like your scope has given up the ghost. You need to shoot the M77 with a scope that is known to be good.

 

[Scarey]

I have Two stainless Ruger M77 MKII. One is a .280 Rem and the other is a 7mm08. I have to admit that the 7-08 shoots better groups by far than my .280 rem. I have had so many scope issues over the years and I know how frustrating they can be. First things first, you made a change to the existing scope and you noticed a change in your grouping. You moved the revival forward for more comfort, pay close attention to your view. If there is a slight black ring around the outside of your view then you are not looking through the scope the same, thus your grouping has changed. I made this mistake many times. You might need to adjust the scope back a little. Hope that helps.

 

[44hunter45]

Practice dry firing your rifle with your eyes closed and a steady squeeze of the trigger. Do this every night at least 20-30 times until you become more comfortable with the rifle. Then go to the shooting range and see how you are shooting then.
Also be sure to keep a good cheek weld and always try to locate your shot on the target through your scope. Don’t pull your head to look.

@Huntingchic2020

This -
Of course all the safety rules apply. Verify the rifle is not loaded, no ammo within arm's reach, etc.
It does not hurt a center fire gun to be dry fired.

I still do, and teach my granddaughter to as well, dry fire at deer in the woods to help cure "Buck Fever". You REALLY make sure the rifle is not loaded when you don't have a tag for that critter. When you find that animal you plan to actually shoot and tag, you can and should dry fire a time or two if you have the time. This will calm you down and help with the actual shot.