SFW Cancer

[warmer]

With all the bulls--t in AZ, UT and AK, what are the odds this band of idiots move east? I know SD, MN and ND are not near as lucrative for tags, but what stops them from trying to get a foothold here? RMEF already gets one of our Custer State Park Bull elk tags to raffle off. I can live with that, I guess, Fin thinks the world of them and that is good enough for me. Just want some tips to stop it from getting started here in Shangra La!

 

[sreekers]

If there is money to be made.......

 

[schmalts]

You will not see them show up where they cannot pimp tags for money.

 

[Big Fin]

If he can find some money to be had, you can be Peay and his band of thieves will be in SD, MN, ND, or even Rhode Island, if he can abscond some public resources to the pocket book of his pals.

Being on the policy and government affairs committee of RMEF, I got to be part of developing the statement RMEF issued in AZ last week. While reviewing that statement I inquired about the tags RMEF is awarded to sell. In every instance, they require the net proceeds to go back to the state agency for habitat work. In most instances they receive a 10% selling commission and in one instance they were provided a 15% commission. The most recent tag they sold for AZ at Elk Camp, RMEF got a 0% commission and still paid the credit card merchant fee. Out of these percentages RMEF receives, RMEF are pays the 2-3% credit card merchant fee on the total sales price.

RMEF receives anywhere from 0% to 15%, before paying the merchant fee. Not sure where the SD tag falls in that range, but I can find out, if you want.

There is a lot of talk within organizations to determine if it is even worth being involved in these tag auctions, given what net proceeds are realized and the growing amount of negative press that can be associated with them. If you know for sure the proceeds given to the states are being put into the ground, maybe a very limited number of tags can be justified. These tags are not designed to be the revenue source for funding organizations, but rather to improve access and habitat, either via the money the state receives or the amount the conservation group receives..

 

[wyoming556]

The dakotas and nebraska arent nearly as lucrative but with sheep and elk tags as a possibility i would not be surprised. I know nebraska auctioned one off last year at the Grand Slam Club/Ovis Hunter and Outfitter Convention in Las Vegas for 117,500

Quote for article "His bid was the highest amount paid during auctions of bighorn permits offered by other states at the Grand Slam event, Hoffman said. A Montana permit sold for about $40,000 while a Wyoming permit sold for about $50,000.

There could be several reasons the Nebraska permit commanded such a high price. First, all of the 15 bighorn rams killed in Nebraska since 1998 have scored 173 or higher. A score of 180 is the minimum required for a bighorn to qualify for the Boone and Crockett Club trophy record book."

Read more: http://journalstar.com/news/state-a...d48-5127-8e3d-52ce9d9d59e7.html#ixzz1oBKwCKtq

 

[warmer]

Fin, would you get me the south dakota numbers?

 

[Battleborn]

I think the 10% mark is a reasonable percentage as long as we know the remaining money will go back to the state F&G. Transparency regarding auction / raffle tags in the future, through respected and honorable organizations prior to the event, could help with any ill perceptions spawned by the evil doers. I personally would hate to see a few bad apples ruin the whole concept of raising a few extra funds for our state wildlife agencies. There will still be the issue of how many of these tags should go to auction, but that is a conversation that should take place between sportsmen and their respective state officials.

 

[mtmiller]

Quote for article "His bid was the highest amount paid during auctions of bighorn permits offered by other states at the Grand Slam event, Hoffman said. A Montana permit sold for about $40,000 while a Wyoming permit sold for about $50,000.

What MT permit went for $40K?

There could be several reasons the Nebraska permit commanded such a high price. First, all of the 15 bighorn rams killed in Nebraska since 1998 have scored 173 or higher. A score of 180 is the minimum required for a bighorn to qualify for the Boone and Crockett Club trophy record book."

173"

 

[mtmiller]

Just kind of like this quote from the article.

The Nebraska Panhandle has four herds of Rocky Mountain bighorn sheep with a combined population approaching 300 animals, Hoffman said. The rams targeted by hunters tend to be at the ends of their life spans, he added.

 

[wyoming556]

What MT permit went for $40K?


173"

I wondered the same thing when I read the article.

 

[Topgun 30-06]

This just went up on the MM website last night from Chris Denham:

Gentlemen,
First of all, I appreciate all your comments, both good and bad, that you have posted over the past couple months. I have remained silent for a period of time while I’ve tried to intelligently digest these opinions and views, and ultimately address you with a clear mind. This has also been a very busy time for me, so I appreciate your patience.

As many of you may know, I have given a large portion of my time, effort, and money to wildlife over the past couple of decades. I feel very strongly about a hunter’s obligation to conservation. Over these many years, I feel like I have proven that by putting my effort, time, and money where my mouth is. Here are a few things I’ve done in that time:
• Co-founder of Outdoor Experience 4 All – OE4A’s mission is to take kids with terminal diagnoses, physical disabilities, and children of our fallen heroes on outdoor experiences.
• Arizona Big Game Super Raffle - Founding member and current Secretary
• Arizona Elk Society – Founding member
• Arizona Sportsmen for Wildlife Conservation – Founding member
• Arizona Deer Association – Past President, Vice President, and Board Member
• Arizona Bowhunters Association – Past Treasurer
• Arizona Wildlife Federation – Past Board Member
• Life Member of B&C
• Member of RMEF
• Life Member of NRA
• Member of Wild Sheep Foundation
• Member of Arizona Desert Bighorn Sheep Society

Recently, I was involved with the controversy in regard to a bill that was proposed in Arizona. Without going into a 400-page novel here because now it’s all a moot point and an ever-changing conversation, there were a lot of projects and goals in Arizona that were (and still are) in need of serious help – some very “big picture” items and many specific ones as well. After trying for years to raise awareness and funds for these projects and not generating what we felt we needed for these important issues, the decision was made to try alternate funding, and that included additional governor and raffle tags.
Looking back, this all boils down to whether or not “the end justified the means”. Obviously, at the time, I felt the projects were important enough that yes, the end did justify the means. If ultimately I misjudged the wishes of Arizona sportsmen, and in their view the end did not justify the means, then you all have my most sincere apology.

This may be a surprise to some, but I do not like auction tags in any form, they shouldn't have to exist. I believe that all sportsmen should step up and cover 100% of the cost of any program or project necessary to ensure our sporting heritage, kind of like a flat tax. Sadly, between the gross mismanagement of license revenue and general apathy amongst the majority of sportsmen, this has never happened. Auction tag revenues (I can only speak for Arizona) have been used to substantially improve wildlife habitat and increase wildlife populations across the state. For instance, the vast majority of the wild sheep herds around Arizona owe their existence to the revenue derived from auction tags. The rejuvenation of the Kaibab deer herd is a direct result of a massive amount of research instigated by the Arizona Deer Association with the use of tag revenues. Many of the people opposed to auction tags are either philosophically opposed and/or just not willing to forego one tag if it means their odds of drawing a tag are affected in any way. I can’t and won’t argue with the former; in fact I admire anyone who will “take a bullet” in defense of his principles and integrity.
I had absolutely nothing to gain personally by being a part of this, and as you can see from what I mentioned above in my past work, I would never want to do anything to A) tarnish my own good name, or B) be a part of anything that would not benefit Arizona sportsmen. Have I made mistakes? Heck yes! Were there mistakes made in the introduction of HB2072? Absolutely, and once I had a better understanding of the problems, I reached a point where I could no longer support the bill.

By making this statement, I don’t expect to change everyone’s mind. I fully expect that there will be those who won’t either listen or care, and that’s fine. I just want to let anyone who does care, to know the score. I won’t come out and say that I don’t support any number of auction tags; I do feel they have a place in a limited number that sportsmen can support.

I also am not going to throw any person or organization under the bus. Of all the organizations listed above, I could easily find something that I don’t like about each one. However, I’m just not in the business of condemning any group or organization of volunteers and conservationists who are working hard in some way for wildlife and/or hunters’ rights.

I’m well aware that coming onto these forums is not always in the best interest of an industry “target”, since there are those out there who have no intention of having civil discussion or getting past a bump in the road. Too many times the internet becomes a place for people to take out every frustration in their lives via the anonymity of a computer screen. However, I feel with the events of the last few months, I do want to take this opportunity to let you know what’s on my mind about it, as well as letting you all know that I respect you enough to address you, since you have asked me to. Please do know, though, that I have no plans in dragging this out any further than this message. There is simply no more to say.

Finally, for those of you on the fence about Elk Hunter and/or Western Hunter Magazines, I’d like to say a few things. First, there’s a reason we brought Ryan Hatfield on board as our Editor. My opinion is that Ryan is the best hunting magazine editor out there, and hunters should be glad that someone like him is in this important position. His vision for these magazines, as well as the quality and standards he wants to send to all our readers, is second to none. If I didn’t believe that he had the skills and ideals to ultimately make these magazines the best out there, we wouldn’t have joined forces with him. Ryan is selective about what he allows in the magazine, because he takes very seriously the obligation of his job and the magazine itself to set a good example with reverence for the wildlife we cherish and for the hunt itself. I highly urge you all to consider taking a good hard look at what we’re going to be bringing to the table. I truly believe that it will be in line with what you all would expect a western big game publication should be.

This is not a ploy to sell subscriptions. I simply feel that you all deserve to be addressed respectfully and told the truth. A few people on internet forums have chosen to attack some of our editors with childish threats that would embarrass the entire sporting community. Please leave them out of this. If you have a beef with me, then bring it to me. My email is [email protected].

I’ve decided that over the next few months, I’m going to slow down significantly in the conservation realm, which has been a goal of mine for two years. I’ve done my share or maybe a little more, and I think it’s time for a break to focus more on family and doing my part, along with our editorial staff, to give people the best product we possibly can, and something you’ll all be exceptionally proud of. Thank you all so much for your time.

Thank You

Chris Denham