Larry Craig VS Salmon

BuzzH

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Looks like good 'ol Larry is up to his usual political B.S.

He doesnt like the numbers of anadromous fish counted at the fish killing dams...so, just get rid of the Fish Passage Center.

Why do people from Idaho vote for this prick?

Zeroing Out the Messenger
Idaho Senator Eliminates Funds for Center on Salmon Survival

By Blaine Harden
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, November 30, 2005; Page A21

PORTLAND, Ore. -- In a surgical strike from Capitol Hill, Sen. Larry E. Craig (R-Idaho) has eliminated a little-known agency that counts endangered fish in the Columbia River.

The Fish Passage Center, with just 12 employees and a budget of $1.3 million, has been killed because it did not count fish in a way that suited Craig.

"Data cloaked in advocacy create confusion," Craig said on the Senate floor this month, after successfully inserting language in an energy and water appropriations bill that bans all future funding for the Fish Passage Center. "False science leads people to false choices."

Here in Portland, Michele DeHart, a fish biologist who is the longtime manager of the center, said she is not mad at Craig.

"What's the point?" asked DeHart, 55, who for nearly 20 years has run the agency that keeps score on the survival of endangered salmon as they negotiate federal dams in the Columbia and Snake rivers.

"I have never met the man," she said. "Never talked to him. No one from his office ever contacted us. I guess I am flabbergasted. We are biologists and computer scientists, and what we do is just math. Math can't hurt you."

But the mathematics of protecting salmon swimming in the nation's largest hydroelectric system can hurt your pocketbook -- particularly in the Northwest, where dams supply power to four out of five homes, more than anywhere in the country.

Salmon math has clearly riled up Craig, who in his last election campaign in 2002 received more money from electric utilities than from any other industry and who has been named "legislator of the year" by the National Hydropower Association.

The Fish Passage Center has documented, in excruciating statistical detail, how the Columbia-Snake hydroelectric system kills salmon. Its analyses of fish survival data also suggest that one way to increase salmon survival is to spill more water over dams, rather than feed it through electrical turbines.

This suggestion, though, is anathema to utilities -- and to Craig -- because water poured over dams means millions of dollars in lost electricity generation.

Last summer, a federal judge in Portland, using data and analysis from the Fish Passage Center, infuriated the utilities. He ordered that water be spilled over federal dams in the Snake River to increase salmon survival. Shortly after Judge James A. Redden issued his order, Craig began pushing to cut all funding for the Fish Passage Center.

"Idaho's water should not be flushed away on experimental policies based on cloudy, inexact assumption," Craig said in a news release.
 
Craig is firmly in the back pocket of the utility industry. No doubt about it. I can't believe people vote for such an asshole, but I bet if you were to check with the Idaho voters on HT most of them vote for Craig because they're too stupid to know what he really stands for.
 
but I bet if you were to check with the Idaho voters on HT most of them vote for Craig because they're too stupid to know what he really stands for.

Gee Ithaca....out to win friends again last night I see :rolleyes:

Do you really think that ID HuntTalkers are, as you say, that stupid or don't you think, that as is the case in most states of the west, the fact that the voting populous in the few major cities in the state carries nearly all the voting clout for crap like this? Not much different than here in Cali where everybody will quickly throw the entire north half of the state under the bus because SanFran and LaLa land by themselves can out-vote the entire 15-20 northern counties COMBINED.....
 
Hey BigHole,

When is the last time you made a post that was on the topic, instead of just attacking somebody because they are smarter than you? Here you have a senior senator from a western state who is in the pocket of the NRA in order to make sure he gets all the votes of the ignorant HuntTalk rednecks who somehow think their -o6 is gonna get banned. And this Senator thrives on the votes of the ignorant rednecks, spends tons of NRA money to make sure he can get elected and RUIN hunting and fishing in Idaho.

Why not address the topic, unless you are too big of an idiot?
 
Jose,

Weren't you and IT whining a while back about all of YOUR money the politicians were blowing. Now one wants to save you some money, and you're still whining. You two remind me of an old lady with a yeast infection.......whine, whine, whine...............
 
BigHole,
Where I have been whining about Dubya's fiscal suicide and burdens he is putting on future generations of Americans in order to fund his ill-conceived quagmire that is the War for Oil?

Are you really that big of an idiot that you think Craig closed down the fish counting in order to be fiscally responsible? Please explain how not having data will save the country money as we try and have fishing and hunting in Idaho?

I am betting you can't, but am willing to give you a chance before pointing out to everybody what a stupid idiot you are.

You're on the clock.....
 
Need to get rid of about ten thousand more projects like this and save some real money. How many years do you need to count anything before you understand the trends? These projects become lifetime careers and the bottom line is the voters understand the tradeoffs of growth, power needs etc. and make choices to balance the perpetual demands of the population and the out of whack demands of a small minority of enviro nuts and gubmint sucks.
 
Whine, whine, whine.........whine. The dam breeching activists lie to push their agenda. Craig comes back with a fastball under the chin. Whine, whine, whine. If you don't like Craig, vote him out, but quit whining about it.
 
Gunner- (Real ? here...not being a smart azz) do your rednecks actually get out and vote? What I mean is does your rural community combined have even half the powder to blow off Boise and Sun Valley?

What I'm getting at as we all want to think that these states across the "west" are these hunting and fishing meccas that are gonna do the best for fish and wildlife. I don't think the tail even comes close to wagging that dog anymore- Idaho has something like 40+/- counties and I bet over half have a pop density of less than 10 people/sq mi.

Point being IF you could convince everyone of Ithacas dumb azz rednecks to :confused: vote, and IF they voted for what we as sportsmen consider is proper for wildlife enhancement- would it make a freakin difference anyhow when the condo comandos run the show anyway???
 
Hey Marv,

You obviously are about 10x smarter than BigHole. It is funny how BigSore can't even follow these issues, so he just has to dream about other guy's crotches and undergarments. I wonder how close he lives to Anaconda?

As for your question, only Blaine County (Sun Valley) was won by the Democrat in the last Gov election. I think Ada County (Boise) and Canyon (Nampa/Caldwell) were carried by the GOP. Canyon has elected a single Democrat to the legislature in the last 30 years.

All the influx of growth into Ada/Canyon is even more right-wing that the current population. The people moving up here from California tend to be racist idiots, trying to flee the diversity that is California. Therefore they tend to follow the rednecks to the NRA-owned Senior Senator. (Keep in mind, very few of these new residents even hunt or fish, they just want to elect officials that cater to rednecks.)
 
Jose I guess, with my simple mind, that I don't even look at it as a Dem vs. Repub. kinda thang...hell they all runa bout 90% crooks in my book, I look at it more as rural vs. urban when it comes to most of the wildlife issues. Granted my perspective might be a bit jaded after being back in the land of fruit & nuts for the last 19 years but it seems like out this way most wildlife related issues come down to those who care (the voting few in the sticks) vs those who couldn't give a flip in the cities.


That is more so on regional/state (no mtmiller we aren't scoring anything here ;) ) wildlife issues such as doe hunts, lions, salmon funding, etc.
The bigger pork bbl. type topics probably do factor in quite a bit more of the political slants than the hicks vs. the blacktop dwellers I speaking to.

So what you're telling me is that you guys are getting all our rednecks leaving us with even more city folks to deal with??? Hell we're gonna be like Portland before its over!

I'll check back later...gotta go coach the daughter's basketball game!

By the way, Calpine's down to $0.28...you buying yet ?? :D
 
Ringer said, "How many years do you need to count anything before you understand the trends?"

Ringer, its pretty obvious to me that you dont have even a remote clue on how politics are played out in the resource management field. You absolutely need many years worth of data proving your point to even have a remote chance at convincing dumbshit senators like Larry Craig. They dont understand the issues and unfortunately in todays world of court cases (where 90% of the important resource management decisions are decided) you better have your stuff together...and you better have lots of convincing and peer-reveiwed scientific data to back up your stance. The public, the agencies, and the courts will shred your ass in a heartbeat without top notch and longterm data.

Craig didnt like the data that proved beyond a doubt whats killing fish in the Snake and Columbia...so just eliminate the funding for the agency counting fish. That way he can pull a number out of his ass...just like he does everything else.
 
So what if you prove by the data that the dams hurt the salmon runs and the majority of the voters still say to support the dams and will take a lower run of fish as a tradeoff? Next stop is the 9th circus court to sue the people so the minority can have their way. I personally don't care if you blow every dam in the country and we all have to heat with wood and kill our food every day. I like to fish for salmon. Just know that the dams will win this one and it isn't just one politician.
 
So what if you prove by the data that the dams hurt the salmon runs and the majority of the voters still say to support the dams and will take a lower run of fish as a tradeoff?
I don't think endangered species issues are left to the voters, but are determined by law. I think the day of the dam is nearing it's end. The power plant my dad works at could probably cover all the electricity lost if we removed the dam with little effort.
 
Pointer,

Thank you for pointing out the facts to Ringer...even though he's obviously never let those facts get in the way of his non-sense.

Its hard to imagine that people like Ringer can be that unaware of whats going on around them...in particular when they claim to be "sportsmen"??? Unbelievable.
 
Truth must hurt. Maybe if there was a little more reason in the enviro movement instead of ruining peoples lives over the fur bellied minnow and burning the forests as a result of overreaching lawsuits you would get more mainstream support. Nothing worse than the new generation of hippies.
 
ringer, so the only people who don't want salmon to go extinct are hippies? :confused:

Oh well, it doesn't matter anyway, because it will not be decided by voters, but by law, as 1 pointer said.
 

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