Judge blocks Grizzly hunt

[Ben Lamb]

Wasn't the wolf issue settled by US Congress? ESA needs to be revised to reduce the chances dipshit judges have to get in the way.

Yes, on wolves. But that was after a long time of trying to separate Wyoming from ID & MT. There was a distinct legal issue at play, which the plaintiffs are trying to use in the Grizzly bear place, but I don't think it will work once we get past the first lawsuit and hit appeals.

Senator John Barrasso has a draft bill right now that may be a good faith effort to put forward a bipartisan reform of the ESA.

Judges are looking at he law, not the science. We are a nation of laws, so rather than bash judges, let's work to make the law function better.

 

[BuzzH]

Remember when we "wouldn't ever have a wolf season", "wouldn't ever have a bison hunt"???

I do, and guess what, we have both...and guess what, we'll have a grizzly season too.

As per Ben Lambs post, we are a nation of laws and we do battle in court...just the way it is.

Nothing to lose your chit over, just let the process play out.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Remember when we "wouldn't ever have a wolf season", "wouldn't ever have a bison hunt"???

I do, and guess what, we have both...and guess what, we'll have a grizzly season too.

As per Ben Lambs post, we are a nation of laws and we do battle in court...just the way it is.

Nothing to lose your chit over, just let the process play out.

Yep.

Stay calm and keep yer powder dry.

 

[MTGomer]

What I saw were ranchers exercising their legal rights under the 10(j) rule...

I didn’t kno 10(j) allowed for poisoning, but I’m not as familiar with it as you are.

 

[BuzzH]

I didn’t kno 10(j) allowed for poisoning, but I’m not as familiar with it as you are.

Then you weren't paying attention...USDA can kill all sorts of critters all kinds of ways, including poison.

 

[Irrelevant]

Then don't vote for the same politicians these so-called eco groups are in bed with. I was pretty confident I knew how this case was going to go as soon as I saw who appointed the judge.

This is definitely a struggle, as I think everyone has expressed you can't ever find a politician you can agree with on every issue, including who they pick for judges.

 

[MTGomer]

Come on Buzz, it’s 11 AM mountain time. Too late to still need coffee, too early to be shitfaced for Labor Day. Try to keep up. We are talking about ranchers not the USDA.

To further clarify in the most black and white terms possible for those apparently needed it, I am saying that before wolves were managed reasonably people were extremely frustrated and right or wrong- they were illegally killing wolves.

It will come as no surprise to me when ranchers, rural homeowners, etc shoot a grizzly bear in the head and leave it to rot. Illegal, disgusting, poaching, etc but not surprising.

I too think there will eventually be a hunt whether this year, next or in 5 years.

 

[BrentD]

Remember when we "wouldn't ever have a wolf season", "wouldn't ever have a bison hunt"???

I do, and guess what, we have both...and guess what, we'll have a grizzly season too.

As per Ben Lambs post, we are a nation of laws and we do battle in court...just the way it is.

Nothing to lose your chit over, just let the process play out.

Exactly right. This will eventually sort out and I have no doubt at all there will be a season. Maybe not this year, maybe not quite the way that they have set it up for the first time, but it will happen. Just like wolves, alligators, and many others.

 

[BuzzH]

Come on Buzz, it’s 11 AM mountain time. Too late to still need coffee, too early to be shitfaced for Labor Day. Try to keep up. We are talking about ranchers not the USDA.

...and you would appear to be too old to believe in fairy tales.

I know the ranching community real well, have worked with them my entire life...they don't under utilize the USDA for taking care of their predator problems.

 

[ChrisS]

Politics over science - again.

I suppose that all of the folks agitating for a grizzly hunt based "on the science" are also agitating for a comprehensive and effective climate change policy based "on the science."

 

[BrentD]

I suppose that all of the folks agitating for a grizzly hunt based "on the science" are also agitating for a comprehensive and effective climate change policy based "on the science."

What would you prefer? Climate change policy based on innuendo and partisan politics? If so, count yourself lucky, 'cuz that's what you are getting.

 

[HSi-ESi]

I suppose that all of the folks agitating for a grizzly hunt based "on the science" are also agitating for a comprehensive and effective climate change policy based "on the science."

Actually, after the decision yesterday - that is one of the issues that irritates me. Both sides like to have it both ways - which is why you have to fall back to the laws and work within the system.

As a scientist, having decisions made by folks interpreting data with a limited knowledge set is very frustrating.

 

[ChrisS]

Actually, after the decision yesterday - that is one of the issues that irritates me. Both sides like to have it both ways - which is why you have to fall back to the laws and work within the system.

As a scientist, having decisions made by folks interpreting data with a limited knowledge set is very frustrating.

I've been an environmental scientist involved in remedial cleanup of hazardous waste sites for going on 15 years. Trust me, I have one guy saying that he'd drink a cup of the discharge from his plant (spoiler alert: he wouldn't) to people freaking out because there are high concentrations of dissolved metals in groundwater near their neighborhood (spoiler alert: they're on city water anyway) demanding that we spend millions trying to cleanup naturally occurring metals.

Personally, I think climate change is a much much much much larger threat to our ecosystems and hunting opportunities than not being able to hunt a handful of grizzlies every year, so I welcome all the staunch defenders of science-based policy to the fold.

 

[MTGomer]

In other news, young man who grew up on ranches working in western Montana tells about his first hand accounts of what ranchers illegally did to wolves is just a fairytale. Got it.

I’m going deer hunting.

Enjoy arguing where there’s nothing to argue about.
Enjoy your raise too......

 

[rustneversleeps]

In other news, young man who grew up on ranches working in western Montana tells about his first hand accounts of what ranchers illegally did to wolves is just a fairytale. Got it.

I’m going deer hunting.

Enjoy arguing where there’s nothing to argue about.
Enjoy your raise too......

Shoot, shovel, shut up is a fairy tale?

 

[MTGomer]

Shoot, shovel, shut up is a fairy tale?

Mostly. It really goes like… bait, poison, brag to the neighbors, wonder why the whole world knows.

 

[BrentD]

Mostly. It really goes like… bait, poison, brag to the neighbors, wonder why the whole world knows.

I would have bet that it mostly goes, hint, hint, drink, blab, drink, blab, drink some more. Never happened.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Shoot, shovel, shut up is a fairy tale?

It's that third S that's always tripping folks up.

 

[haiku_rodney]

In the interim, I would like to see all those who challenged the hunt to pay into a fund which the ranchers can draw from for livestock losses.

 

[EYJONAS!]

In the interim, I would like to see all those who challenged the hunt to pay into a fund which the ranchers can draw from for livestock losses.

Don't they got a go fund me account going?