FWP lies about Corner Crossing

[Elky Welky]

Montana FWP misstates the law here by telling the public that corner crossing is "unlawful" based upon FAQ guidance from 2021 that has not yet been updated. To be very clear: there is no law for OR against corner crossing in Montana. This is a legal gray area which has not been decided yet. I've reached out to the department to correct this false information, but be advised that the department is providing incorrect legal advice. Advice that, in my opinion, does not favor the public land user, and those of us who pay for their salaries and work, and pay taxes on those lands.

Based upon this statement, Montana FWP is advocating that people in Montana be prosecuted if they choose to corner-cross, so you do so at your own risk. Should you be prosecuted, Montana courts could view this issue differently. The Wyoming case does not have any precedence here, although it provides excellent logic. If only FWP would listen.https://fwp.mt.gov/homepage/news/2023/jun/0601-fwp-issues-statement-on-wyoming-corner-crossing-case

 

[TOGIE]

colorado: legislature putting through attempts to try and make it legal

wyoming: criminal court acquits, federal judge says it's legal, legislature amends bill re. air space.

then montana: tries to intimidate its own sportsmen and women into not corner crossing

man if it weren't for those western skies and that open range i don't know how you folks would keep living there

 

[noharleyyet]

colorado: legislature putting through attempts to try and make it legal

wyoming: criminal court acquits, federal judge says it's legal, legislature amends bill re. air space.

then montana: tries to intimidate its own sportsmen and women into not corner crossing

man if it weren't for those western skies and that open range i don't know how you folks would keep living there

 

[rogerthat]

colorado: legislature putting through attempts to try and make it legal

wyoming: criminal court acquits, federal judge says it's legal, legislature amends bill re. air space.

then montana: tries to intimidate its own sportsmen and women into not corner crossing

man if it weren't for those western skies and that open range i don't know how you folks would keep living there

Yeah it’s honestly not worth it. It’s damn depressing. Been here my whole life but things have really went down the chitter in this state.

 

[Schaaf]

Be sure to ask them what changed, besides the Governor, that would force them to go back on their decades long precedent of not taking a stand on the issue one way or another.

 

[brocksw]

I wonder if/how much AG Knudsen was involved in drafting this statement.

 

[Beignet]

If a state agency flat out tells me something is against the law I’d like to see them cite some code telling me exactly what law that might be.

 

[seeth07]

Maybe Montana just wants to live up to what everyone thinks of them through Yellowstone? Its all about having good drama? I know I'm at the edge of my seat seeing how this shakes out as a result of this statement!

 

[The Hedgehog]

The only reason there's any living breathing furry animals anywhere in the state is because of the few places the hunting is restricted (mostly private or blocked access).

As good as being able to access more public is for hunting - the net result in MT will be way, WAY more piss pounded public land.

Back to crossbow use impacts..

 

[Elky Welky]

If a state agency flat out tells me something is against the law I’d like to see them cite some code telling me exactly what law that might be.

Which they can't. There is neither code nor case law that makes corner crossing in Montana illegal or legal. The legislature writes the laws, the judiciary interprets them, but the executive branch, in my view, has no authority to declare the law as they see fit.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Be sure to ask them what changed, besides the Governor, that would force them to go back on their decades long precedent of not taking a stand on the issue one way or another.

To be fair there was a bill in 2013 to legalize it but of course it died in committee.

 

[brocksw]

To be fair there was a bill in 2013 to legalize it but of course it died in committee.

Was AG Knudsen on that committee? He was in the house at that time I believe. On his way to speaker of the house a couple years later.

 

[rogerthat]

The only reason there's any living breathing furry animals anywhere in the state is because of the few places the hunting is restricted (mostly private or blocked access).

As good as being able to access more public is for hunting - the net result in MT will be way, WAY more piss pounded public land.

Back to crossbow use impacts..

Your completely right but two completely separate issues at play

 

[Beignet]

Which they can't. There is neither code nor case law that makes corner crossing in Montana illegal or legal. The legislature writes the laws, the judiciary interprets them, but the executive branch, in my view, has no authority to declare the law as they see fit.

That’s what makes their position on the subject such a crock. Curious how they plan to instruct their department’s law enforcement to make charges in a corner crossing case if they don’t have a statue to back it up?

I just sent them an email asking for the dang citation and about what changed that I might’ve missed since their 2001 memo.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Was AG Knudsen on that committee? He was in the house at that time I believe. On his way to speaker of the house a couple years later.

2017 - Primary Sponsor - Tom Jacobson (D) HD 21

https://leg.mt.gov/bills/2017/billpdf/HB0662.pdf

Killed in Judiciary - Members



2013- Primary Sponsor- Ellie Boldman Hill (D) HD 94

https://leg.mt.gov/bills/2013/billpdf/HB0235.pdf

Killed in Judiciary - Members

 

[Wind Gypsy]

Be sure to ask them what changed, besides the Governor, that would force them to go back on their decades long precedent of not taking a stand on the issue one way or another.

The interpretation seems to acknowledge it as a "technical trespass" numerous times and advises the wardens to let the county attorneys deal with it, which is basically what the statement says. Not saying that the change from advising against to calling it unlawful doesn't paint an ugly picture given the context but to me the statement aligns with the interpretation letter unless i'm just ignorant of what "technical trespass" means.

Edit: I missed an important distinction the first go round.. he said "Wardens will continue to report corner crossing cases to local county attorneys to exercise their prosecutorial discretion.” vs "we will not issue a citation and should refer the landowner who complains of trespass to the county attorney". Reporting it to the CA vs telling the landowner to go deal with the CA are definitely different.

 

[Irishman]

The only reason there's any living breathing furry animals anywhere in the state is because of the few places the hunting is restricted (mostly private or blocked access).

As good as being able to access more public is for hunting - the net result in MT will be way, WAY more piss pounded public land.

Back to crossbow use impacts..

I don't agree. The more land that there is access too, then the more spread out hunting pressure is. There are huge areas in the state with very little private land, that still have lots of wildlife. Besides, if we end out getting denied access to public land, then what does it matter if it has wildlife on it or not?

 

[Beignet]

2017 - Primary Sponsor - Tom Jacobson (D) HD 21

https://leg.mt.gov/bills/2017/billpdf/HB0662.pdf

Killed in Judiciary - Members
View attachment 278207


2013- Primary Sponsor- Ellie Boldman Hill (D) HD 94

https://leg.mt.gov/bills/2013/billpdf/HB0235.pdf

Killed in Judiciary - Members
View attachment 278206

Not surprised to see two members of a certain family whose last name begins and ends with the same letter in both of those.

 

[The Hedgehog]

I don't agree. The more land that there is access too, then the more spread out hunting pressure is. There are huge areas in the state with very little private land, that still have lots of wildlife. Besides, if we end out getting denied access to public land, then what does it matter if it has wildlife on it or not?

We'll have to agree to disagree.

If all the sudden, all private land was open to hunting in MT, what would happen? 1) everybody would be spread out and we'd have perfect harmony and hunting happiness, or 2) every living, breathing, animal in MT would likely be smoked meat in the matter of a couple seasons.

 

[Elky Welky]

https://billingsgazette.com/outdoor...944864f49.html#tracking-source=home-top-story