Full Cost of the Federal Grazing Program

[Ithaca 37]

As a true Conservative, I am appalled at the federally subsidized grazing program that has led to the destruction of our once beautiful and productive federal land. This report gives an accounting of some of the costs to taxpayers. Just start by scrolling to the Executive Summary near the top:

http://www.biologicaldiversity.org/swcbd/Programs/grazing/Assessing_the_full_cost.pdf

"The range management programs of the BLM and Forest Service run at a loss of about $124 million, after subtracting fee receipts. This however, is just the tip of the iceberg. Numerous programs both in and outside the two agencies also bear costs related to the grazing program. We could find no system that adequately accounts for all of these costs."”

Troy, sdgunslinger, MD4M and the rest of you welfare rancher supporters---please have someone read this to you.

Then defend welfare ranching or admit it's indefensible!

 

[ELKCHSR]

I can't read any of it, it is to small...
I would venture a guess on this, but if it is like pretty much any other standard Fed. program, there is so much hidden costs that logistics and paper work pretty much eat up any money's that were earmarked for the intended individuals...

 

[Muledeer4me]

ROFLMAO,Ithaca please have some read this to you

You are a boring broken record.

 

[Ithaca 37]

MD4M, Just what I thought! When confronted by facts you can't defend it.

 

[Oak]

Yep, just like the Greenie post. The Welfare Rancher lovers can't come to grips with the fact that there actually might be real hunters out there who can see what they're doing to the land. So, they choose to ignore it. Of course, none of those hunters probably served in the military, therefore they shouldn't be allowed to bitch about it.

Oak

 

[Ithaca 37]

Here, I'll make it easy to find a more readable report:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q =assessing+full+cost+of+federal+grazing+program&btnG=Google+Search

I really do want to see some intelligent defense of welfare ranching.

Maybe I'll change my mind about it if confronted by some facts contrary to what I've learned about it in the last twenty years!

Please help me.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 04-01-2003 08:33: Message edited by: Ithaca 37 ]</font>

 

[Lostagain]

Here ya go IT.

Its the judo-christian belief that God put all this here for Man. Until you can realize that fact, then you bitching about the wrong problems/source.

 

[Ithaca 37]

Earth calling Lostagain!! You think that is the justification for welfare ranching?!!!

 

[Lostagain]

Earth calling IT=== you are not going to get rid of welfare ranching until ya get rid of some folks idea of manifest destiny.

Its all tied together.

 

[Ithaca 37]

Lost, that theory is right up there with your theory about poaching being a good thing for F&G Depts. 'cuz poaching fines help wildlife! (or whatever it was you were trying to claim

)

Keep circling Saturn 'til we give you the "all clear" for landing!

 

[Washington Hunter]

Lostagain has that right...some people really do think that way! Isn't that amazing? But it's true. I wonder what those same idiots think deer and elk are here for? Does god want people to wipe out all wildlife out so we can raise more cattle?

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 04-02-2003 21:16: Message edited by: Washington Hunter ]</font>

 

[Washington Hunter]

Lost, you don't believe in that theory do you?

 

[JoseCuervo]

Ithica,

Here is my best defense of Welfare Ranching for you. Let me know how I did...

Welfare Ranching is required on most of our Public Lands in order to improve the quality of the range and attempt to restore the habitat as close to its native origins as possible. Since the influx of the Out of State Hunter, the conditions of the rangeland on Public Grounds has worsened, due to the Horse Hunters who brought all the Cheet infested hay into the area. Why Hunters, who claim to love Wildlife, refuse to bring Certified Hay is amazing to me.

Right now, more than 80% of all BLM ground is infested with Cheet, and if not for the Patriotic, Flag Waving, Welfare Rancher who graciously brings his cows to the range, the conditions would be even worse. It takes a Patriot to provide cattle to keep the Cheet ate down to within 1/16th of an inch. So next time you see a Welfare Rancher give him a big thanks, because without him, BLM ground would become 90% Cheet.

(I have another attempt, about how Welfare Ranchers provide significant Cultural and Economic support to many small communities, that is difficult to measure in Dollars and Cents.)

Ithica, let me know if I have now provided you with an intelligent defense of the Welfare Rancher

 

[Ithaca 37]

Elkgunner, Thanks!! That's the most insightful and logical explanation of welfare ranching benefits I've ever read!

I suggest you submit it to Range Magazine, they'll love it!

What about the fire prevention benefit of grubbing the grass down to 1/16 of an inch and all the great fertilzer those cows leave behind?

http://www.rangemagazine.com/index.shtml

 

[1_pointer]

I think LA is not offbase here. The biggest hurdle we have, IMO, on natural resource issues is over coming societal hurdles. Many do, especially in the rural West, that the land is here for their benefit only. The people that came and made it in these areas were and still are to some heroes. Why do you think the term wilderness ever came about? To justify the elimination of Indians and allow our access/use of many lands.

I think the view of wildlands by society in general is changing, but it takes time.

 

[ELKCHSR]

I've tried a number of things, and can only get a very small version of every thing, I don't have any idea what is going on with this link for me, all well, I will just move on and skip this one!!!