Do elk use the same rub areas yearly?

[Hermitage]

Howdy everyone,
I'm new to posting on the forum but already a fan. Thanks to everyone who is here sharing in this amazing community. I have a question about elk and their use of rubs, seasonally, as it pertains to archery season. I do a lot of scouting, and a lot of hiking in Elk country, and am constantly exploring new areas, so I don't often return to the same areas and units year after year. My question is: if I am out scouting and find an area with a significant density of rubs (lets say 5-10 rubs in a 200 yard circumference), is this an area the elk will return to next season? I am trying to hone-in on a few areas on one unit this coming year instead of always bouncing around to new places, and I am trying to dig-in a bit more to understand Bull elk behavior. Figured there may be a few experts here
Last year I found an area when I was doing some early scouting for late season rifle elk, and it was torn up and stunk like a barnyard. In my head I was thinking 'oh boy, this is where the big dog lives', but from what I have interpreted, that may not be the case year after year. I would love to return to that area this coming year for archery season, but don't want it to just be a pretty hike, if you know what I mean
Thanks in advance and apologies if this is a rookie question!
Posted some pics below. the first pic shows one of the rubs, and there were three more just like that within twenty feet. Then as the circle widened around that area, there were more rubs further out. Second pic shows what the area looked like ten feet away. pretty much giant piles of deadfall and brush. 20-40 degree slopes. Five miles in....Was fun getting back out of there, haha.

 

[SAJ-99]

Good question. I would say yes. Elk tend to be habitual and are in the same areas each year. Cow elk make the decisions and the bulls follow. There could be some differences depending on the area. Example, If you are hunting high elevation and one fall is warm they may be in a different zone than the next fall if you get an early snow fall.

 

[Hermitage]

Ok, thank you so much for the response. The fact about the cow elk is something I keep forgetting....duh! I'm making a log book of various areas, elevations, etc where I have seen sign or elk at different times of year, but I realize weather, hunting pressure, disease, predators all can throw a kink into that. My plan is to keep scouting and not get locked into one area. I will make sure to keep an eye on the cow behavior as well. Hiking into that area that is five miles in might be good if I have good pre-season intel but its pretty remote so I am gonna have a few backup plans.

 

[Rzrbck918]

Yes and no from my experience. I think they use the same water and meadows much more consistently that exact areas for rubs. My best understanding is that their use of areas for rubs is due to proximity to other more important draws to a geographical location.

 

[Griztrax]

When you find an area that is torn up with rubs and looks and smells like a barnyard, then you have probably found a location that will be used year in and year out. These areas typically have everything the elk need - water, cover, and nearby feeding areas. Based on your observations of the area you described, I would not hesitate to go back in there this year during the rut. You might also consider hanging a game camera in there to get a better feel for elk use of that area. Good luck!

 

[belshawelk]

same area, sometimes same rub.

 

[mdeerjunkie]

In my experience they usually tend to use the same areas, or at least their really close by.
Welcome aboard!

 

[Sytes]

Welcome aboard!
As an avg Joe hunter, I've found elk favor the same *safe areas. If predators have not pushed them off to other areas, I've found fresh rubs in/around old stomping areas.

 

[Hermitage]

Yes and no from my experience. I think they use the same water and meadows much more consistently that exact areas for rubs. My best understanding is that their use of areas for rubs is due to proximity to other more important draws to a geographical location.

Ok thats interesting. And makes sense. thank you!

 

[Hermitage]

When you find an area that is torn up with rubs and looks and smells like a barnyard, then you have probably found a location that will be used year in and year out. These areas typically have everything the elk need - water, cover, and nearby feeding areas. Based on your observations of the area you described, I would not hesitate to go back in there this year during the rut. You might also consider hanging a game camera in there to get a better feel for elk use of that area. Good luck!

Ok that makes me pretty excited, which means I won't be able to focus at work for the next....four months?! haha. SO I failed to mention in my earlier post that I hung a camera up in there and haven't been back there to grab it since its so darn far out there. However, as soon as shed season opens I am planning on getting in there and grabbing that camera and taking a peek at the area again. thanks so much for the feedback!

 

[Hermitage]

Welcome aboard!
As an avg Joe hunter, I've found elk favor the same *safe areas. If predators have not pushed them off to other areas, I've found fresh rubs in/around old stomping areas.

Thanks for the welcome! And this is good to see. Every time I find a new area I try to think about time of year the Elk were there, but the rubs have always been a bit of a conundrum. I am going to go back to that spot this fall and see what shakes out. I'll keep yall posted!

 

[Hermitage]

In my experience they usually tend to use the same areas, or at least their really close by.
Welcome aboard!

Thanks for the welcome! I'm going to try to scout this area as much as possible without spooking or leaving my scent all over the place. Its pretty tough to get in to but that's probably why the Elk like it.

 

[SAJ-99]

Thanks for the welcome! I'm going to try to scout this area as much as possible without spooking or leaving my scent all over the place. Its pretty tough to get in to but that's probably why the Elk like it.

If there are elk there, its a good bet there will be hunters too.

 

[diamond hitch]

Mature bulls have a well defined area. The bugling is to attract the cows to them. The confusing part is the young bulls don't have a defined range yet and tend to follow mom and the girls around. Rubs by the little guys don't have much substance and no defined range and they are tough to pick from the big boys. I guess the best hint is the size of the tree and how high it is pealed. I got to look one year at the results of a regional study on elk with radio collars. I plotted the monthly locations up on a map for a years worth of data. The range of the cows was about 30 miles. The only collared mature bull had a summer/fall range of about 9 square miles. Every month he was on one of three mtn. except June when he evidently went on vacation. The next month he was back to the home range.

Of what I observe here at the ranch, I have three bulls that bugle through the rut around the house. Two are north and one is south. The cows feed in my hay field and the bulls go nuts trying to get them to come to them. Until they are about ready (about the third week in september) they are indifferant.

The other issue is the hiearchy is fairly consistant for a number of years until something happens to the dominant bull. Then the world goes into chaos as the new dominant bull is picked and everything moves to his home range. Kind of like class "C" basketball in rural Montana.

 

[Brian in Montana]

I think a good general answer to this question is: more or less. In my impression, they kind of do, but elk have pretty large home ranges, much bigger than deer. Throw in some rutting crazy and hunting pressure, and who knows.

 

[Brian in Montana]

Also they rub some in their winter range as their antlers are preparing to shed. Rubs can be difficult to interpret in elk country. IMO.

 

[Hermitage]

Mature bulls have a well defined area. The bugling is to attract the cows to them. The confusing part is the young bulls don't have a defined range yet and tend to follow mom and the girls around. Rubs by the little guys don't have much substance and no defined range and they are tough to pick from the big boys. I guess the best hint is the size of the tree and how high it is pealed. I got to look one year at the results of a regional study on elk with radio collars. I plotted the monthly locations up on a map for a years worth of data. The range of the cows was about 30 miles. The only collared mature bull had a summer/fall range of about 9 square miles. Every month he was on one of three mtn. except June when he evidently went on vacation. The next month he was back to the home range.

Of what I observe here at the ranch, I have three bulls that bugle through the rut around the house. Two are north and one is south. The cows feed in my hay field and the bulls go nuts trying to get them to come to them. Until they are about ready (about the third week in september) they are indifferant.

The other issue is the hiearchy is fairly consistant for a number of years until something happens to the dominant bull. Then the world goes into chaos as the new dominant bull is picked and everything moves to his home range. Kind of like class "C" basketball in rural Montana.

Thanks for the input, much appreciated. Looking at the trees and the heights from the area I initially found: three of the trees that were within fifty feet of each other had about a 5" diameter, and they were shaved clean at about chest height. These weren't your typical smaller pines that I see thrashed all the time, these were stout trees that had just been shaved. Part of my thought on that was that the bull bedded there, got up, peed, scraped the dirt a bunch, then went over and scraped the tree, then maybe calmed down, then got up and repeated the same thing again a bit further away. A few other rubs I found about a mile away were puny, tiny rubs on little trees, still high enough to be elk but just not like those big torn up pines or other saplings I usually see. I am thinking those were a different elk, or a small satellite. At least that's the image playing out in my mind.
Its so fascinating to me to try to nail down these animals because they are so huge and as you noted, can cover such large distances, but then I am intrigued to see your comments on the bull having a summer/fall range of 9 miles. Basically just opens up more questions for me. My guess is that he's hanging close to an area that he feels safe in and has all his needs met- so maybe that could be 5 square miles or 20, in order to get what he needs. Then as others are noting, once pressure and rut activity begins, that range can collapse or expand.

 

[Brian in Montana]

I grew up hunting whitetail deer in West Texas. Every fall I go away thinking - wow, these elk are NOT deer.

 

[diamond hitch]

Where it reailly gets interesting is that after the second heat for the late cows ( about the first wek of Mt rifle season) the bulls may bunch up. They often pick up a rag horn or spike as company or judas goat to lead off. If no one gets shot then the big boy will follow the herd a little bit of a lag.

My observation is the bulls will run about 500 ft above the cows and a couple ridges away. About the same info shows up in elk of North America.

 

[HUNTNNW]

I have many places I hunt elk and one thing in common is the elk are there every September in the same areas. You can see years of rubs through out the area. I definitely would keep note of areas that have lots of elk rubs. I found a area on my wifes ID rifle hunt this past year with the most elk rubs I have ever seen in a area, years of history It was a square mile of rubs. Ill be back this summer running cams and archery hunting it