Denied a gun....

[Hilljackoutlaw]

So my uncle won a gun in a raffle my buddy did for his sons travel baseball team. The gun is in idaho and he is in Pennsylvania. He just transferred the gun to me to bring home next time I visit. Mind you I have bought 3 guns from this store over the last 5 years. So I fill out the paperwork and said just call me when it's through with the check and let me know when I can pick up the gun. She calls me an hour later and said the gun is on hold until the 28th and if I don't hear from them by the 28th to come pick it up. Ok thanks. 2 hours later she calls again and says my check came back denied. I said you sure? She said yea I have no idea why. There is some paperwork you can pick up here and maybe that will explain to you why. So ill go get the paperwork tomorrow and see what's up and it's probably just a misunderstanding, but it surely pisses me off a lot! I have no background at all that would prohibit me from getting a gun.

Rant over.

 

[Gellar]

Sounds like a straw purchase. You can’t claim a firearm for someone else.

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

Sounds like a straw purchase. You can’t claim a firearm for someone else.

?

 

[elkantlers]

So my uncle won a gun in a raffle my buddy did for his sons travel baseball team. The gun is in idaho and he is in Pennsylvania. He just transferred the gun to me to bring home next time I visit. Mind you I have bought 3 guns from this store over the last 5 years. So I fill out the paperwork and said just call me when it's through with the check and let me know when I can pick up the gun. She calls me an hour later and said the gun is on hold until the 28th and if I don't hear from them by the 28th to come pick it up. Ok thanks. 2 hours later she calls again and says my check came back denied. I said you sure? She said yea I have no idea why. There is some paperwork you can pick up here and maybe that will explain to you why. So ill go get the paperwork tomorrow and see what's up and it's probably just a misunderstanding, but it surely pisses me off a lot! I have no background at all that would prohibit me from getting a gun.

Rant

What you are doing is technically illegal. That's a Strawman purchase.
You should have your "buddy" send the firearm to an FFL in Pennsylvania for your uncle to pick up there.

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

My uncle can transfer a gun to me as far as I know. He was on the phone with the FFL today and filled out the paperwork to transfer it to me.

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

What you are doing is technically illegal. That's a Strawman purchase.
You should have your "buddy" send the firearm to an FFL in Pennsylvania for your uncle to pick up there.

My "buddy" does not have the gun and never did. The gun has never left the gun store. You win and you have to go to the gun store and pick up your gun after the gun store does your background check.

 

[elkantlers]

My "buddy" does not have the gun and never did. The gun has never left the gun store. You win and you have to go to the gun store and pick up your gun after the gun store does your background check.

So how can your uncle transfer a firearm to you if he has never filled out the original 4473 to take possession of it?

If the gun store transfers the firearm to you, to give to uncle, they are asking for trouble.

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

So how can your uncle transfer a firearm to you if he has never filled out the original 4473 to take possession of it?

If the gun store transfers the firearm to you, to give to uncle, they are asking for trouble.

I'm not sure, but when a reputable gun store says this what we have to fill out so your uncle can transfer you the gun. I believe them, maybe they don't know what the hell they are doing down there???

 

[elkantlers]

I'm not sure, but when a reputable gun store says this what we have to fill out so your uncle can transfer you the gun. I believe them, maybe they don't know what the hell they are doing down there???

I'm an FFL and I can tell you I would never do this if I wanted to keep my license.
Read Question 21.a on the 4473 very carefully.

21.a. Are you the actual transferee/buyer of all of the firearm(s) listed on this form and any continuation sheet(s) (ATF Form 5300.9A)? Warning: You are not the actual transferee/buyer if you are acquiring any of the firearm(s) on behalf of another person. If you are not the actual transferee/buyer, the licensee cannot transfer any of the firearm(s) to you. Exception: If you are only picking up a repaired firearm(s) for another person, you are not required to answer 21.a. and may proceed to question 21.b Yes No

The legal way to get the firearm to your uncle is to have the gun store ship the firearm to an FFL close to your uncle to pick up. That way he can fill out and put his signature on the 4473 to take possession of the firearm. That way if he is denied, like you were, he doesn't take possession of a firearm he isn't supposed to have.
It is absolutely not legal for the gun store to transfer the firearm to you, to give to your uncle.

I get that it's family, and you will most likely never have any problems. But there are better ways to go about getting him the firearm that doesn't put you in a bad spot if something does happen.

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

I'm an FFL and I can tell you I would never do this if I wanted to keep my license.
Read Question 21.a on the 4473 very carefully.

21.a. Are you the actual transferee/buyer of all of the firearm(s) listed on this form and any continuation sheet(s) (ATF Form 5300.9A)? Warning: You are not the actual transferee/buyer if you are acquiring any of the firearm(s) on behalf of another person. If you are not the actual transferee/buyer, the licensee cannot transfer any of the firearm(s) to you. Exception: If you are only picking up a repaired firearm(s) for another person, you are not required to answer 21.a. and may proceed to question 21.b Yes No

The legal way to get the firearm to your uncle is to have the gun store ship the firearm to an FFL close to your uncle to pick up. That way he can fill out and put his signature on the 4473 to take possession of the firearm. That way if he is denied, like you were, he doesn't take possession of a firearm he isn't supposed to have.
It is absolutely not legal for the gun store to transfer the firearm to you, to give to your uncle.

What if my uncle just said I would like to give my winning ticket to my nephew and they ran the background check that way? Cause I just assumed when they were on the phone with my uncle they were getting info to transfer it to me. But maybe he just forfeited his winning ticket to me. Cause I plan on transferring the ownership to him at the local FFL in PA. when I visit home. I'll find out what the heck went on tomorrow when I go to the gun store I guess and update thread.

 

[Doublecluck]

Sounds to me like you won the gun or your uncle will give you the winning ticket and you can gift it to your uncle later.

 

[BackofBeyond]

What if my uncle just said I would like to give my winning ticket to my nephew and they ran the background check that way? Cause I just assumed when they were on the phone with my uncle they were getting info to transfer it to me. But maybe he just forfeited his winning ticket to me. Cause I plan on transferring the ownership to him at the local FFL in PA. when I visit home. I'll find out what the heck went on tomorrow when I go to the gun store I guess and update thread.

I think this is your path forward. Instead of your uncle transferring you the firearm, have him transfer the winning ticket (if the rules of the raffle are ok with that.) But then again, background checks can be weird. I've purchased and went through in 20 minutes, and I've also had to wait 5 days for a deeper dive... turns out there is another guy with my same name, down to the middle initial, that is less than an upstanding citizen. After that experience I learned to put my SS# on the application.

Next step for me is getting my CCL so I can skip all that.

 

[elkantlers]

What if my uncle just said I would like to give my winning ticket to my nephew and they ran the background check that way? Cause I just assumed when they were on the phone with my uncle they were getting info to transfer it to me. But maybe he just forfeited his winning ticket to me. Cause I plan on transferring the ownership to him at the local FFL in PA. when I visit home. I'll find out what the heck went on tomorrow when I go to the gun store I guess and update thread.

If the gun shop is good with it, I say go for it. I would definitely use an FFL to transfer it to your uncle once you get to Pennsylvania. That way you have nothing to worry about when the uncle gives it or sells it to someone else down the line, or it gets stolen.
In this day and age, especially with firearms, it's all about protecting yourself.

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

Well I gotta submit a request to find out the reason. This involves me paying for the request mailing out my finger prints. Seems like a pain in my butt.

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

Uncle is coming to elk hunt in spetember he can just pick the gun up then. Not worth the hassle.

 

[Arcola]

Well I gotta submit a request to find out the reason. This involves me paying for the request mailing out my finger prints. Seems like a pain in my butt.

Sounds like a pain. I'd take yourself out of the equation and have the dealer ship it to his FFL. I had an FFL for several years and your situation/scenario is a picture perfect "straw purchase" red flag. They don't care about the specific details. On the form you would have had to declare that you are the actual transferee. You are not.

I personally receive a "hold" status quite often, when I purchase because there is a felon with my exact name that lives 40 minutes from me. I've just learned to plan ahead and once in a while I'm pleasantly surprised with an "approved".

 

[DouglasR]

Personally, I’m glad to see the system working and keeping this weapon off the streets.

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

I won't name the gun store, but they seemed pretty clueless when I asked specific questions today. Not that big of a deal, like I said he can just grab it in September.

 

[noharleyyet]

Well I gotta submit a request to find out the reason. This involves me paying for the request mailing out my finger prints. Seems like a pain in my butt.

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

Personally, I’m glad to see the system working and keeping this weapon off the streets.

I have been a little on edge lately. Luckily the government has your back.