Bowling for Truth

Calif. Hunter

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An alternative to Michael Moore supporters' -

http://www.bowlingfortruth.com/


A lot there, but Moore makes a lot of allegations in his movies. "To be fair and open-minded, I guess you'll have to read it all...." ;)

Examples -


Early in this segment, Moore states that “only one” member of Congress has a child in Iraq. The action of the segment consists of Moore accosting Congressmen to try to convince them to have their children enlist in the military. At the end, Moore declares, “Not a single member of Congress wanted to sacrifice their child for the war in Iraq.”

Moore’s conclusion is technically true, but duplicitous. Of course no-one would want to “sacrifice” his child in any way. But the fact is, Moore's opening ("only one") and his conclusion ("not a single member") are both incorrect. Sergeant Brooks Johnson, the son of South Dakota Democratic Senator Tim Johnson, serves in the 101st Airborne Division and fought in Iraq in 2003. The son of California Republican Representative Duncan Hunter quit his job after September 11, and enlisted in the Marines; his artillery unit was deployed in the heart of insurgent territory in February 2004. Delaware Senator Joseph Biden's son Beau is on active duty; although Beau Biden has no control over he is deployed, he has not been sent to Iraq, and therefore does not "count" for Moore's purposes.

...

So while Fahrenheit pretended that Kennedy rebuffed Moore, Kennedy agreed to help Moore.

Fahrenheit shows Moore calling out to Delaware Republican Michael Castle, who is talking on a cell phone and waves Moore off. Castle is presented one of the Congressmen who would not sacrifice his children. What the film omits is that Rep. Castle does not have any children.

...

In contrast the ratio of Congressional households to Iraqi service personnel is 535:2. This reduces to a ration of 268:1.

Stated another way, a Congressional household is about 23 percent more likely than an ordinary household to be closely related to an Iraqi serviceman or servicewoman.

Moore ignores the fact that there are 102 veterans currently serving in Congress. Regardless of whether they have children who could join the military, all of the veterans in Congress have personally put themselves at risk to protect their country.

...there's lots more, of course.
 
23% more likely, pretty interesting.

"a Congressional household is about 23 percent more likely than an ordinary household to be closely related to an Iraqi serviceman or servicewoman."
 
Cali,

See what happens when you post those "facts" of yours... You get the gulliable to believe them...

Tom,
Aren't you smarter than to think that a 23% number means anything, on a sample size of two???

And Cali's source is even more questionable than Moore's. For a movie that won at the Cannes film festival, when do you think they had to be done editing it???

It looks like the one kid just got shipped into Iraq in Feb. Probably after the movie was "in the can"...

Tom, can you do the math for us? If two kids equaled 23% more, then how much LESS would 1 kid equal???
 
Elkgunner tries yet again to slant the facts, like his hero, Michael Moore. What difference does the date of someone's enlistment or service in Iraq have to do with the proportion cited at the website? Does that change the fact that 102 members of Congress are veterans themselves? Does that change the obviously biased slant of the question? DO you know of any parent willing to "sacrifice" their child for anything? (Other than Abraham in the Bible?) Most parents would give their own life before that of their child...but the wording is such a marvel of intellect, chosen for a "documentary" to obtain an unbiased point of view. :rolleyes: yeah, sure.

Obviously, EG is a hypocrite and has not gone and read the entire website so that he can have the "open mind" that he claims to have and share only with those who have seen Moore's diatribe, and thus he has an exclusive basis to judge the rest of us "bubbas." Otherwise, he would see the point by point rebuttal of Moore's mockumentary and would have to admit that much, if not most or all, of Moore's film is bogus or only half true at best.
 
Cali,

Let me type slowly for you, so you can keep up. If you need to take your shoes off to help you in the math, please feel free. :eek:

Here is what can be deduced from your source. On Feb 1, 2004, there was no kids in Iraq who's parent was in Congress. On Feb 28, 2004, there was 1 kid. (Duncan Hunter quit his job after September 11, and enlisted in the Marines; his artillery unit was deployed in the heart of insurgent territory in February 2004.) Implying he traveled INTO Iraq sometime during Feb-04.

On, or after Jan 1, 2003 (likely after March-2003) there was a single kid in Iraq with a parent in Congress ( Sergeant Brooks Johnson, the son of South Dakota Democratic Senator Tim Johnson, serves in the 101st Airborne Division and fought in Iraq in 2003. If he was still in Iraq, Cali's source would point out that he was fighting in Iraq in 2003 and 2004.

So here is what Cali's sources claim.

Early -2003 until sometime in 2003 = 1 Kid
Jan 1-2004 until sometime in Feb-04 = 0 Kid
Sometime Feb-04 until current = 1 kid

Don't you think if the Johnson kid was still there, Cali's source would be pointing that out?

So, based on when Moore was doing his documentary, there was either 1 kid, 0 kid, or 1 kid in Iraq.


Cali,
Where did you ever get mis-led that a documentary would be unbiased? Do you think National Geographic's documentaries are unbiased? Have you really been that naive, your whole life, to think that every documentary fed to you in school was unbiased???

Why on earth would a filmmaker want to make a movie, but remove any of their bias???

And Cali,
I did look at your website, and it looked shockingly similar to the 56 Deceits websit. And like the author on the 56 Deceits, it is pointed out that Moore did not lie, nor make things up, but chose to use facts to make HIS point, which the authors of the looney right-wing websites feel deceived, hence the "deceit".

Look at the "smoking gun" on your website, that proves Moore is a complete liar... :rolleyes: Yeppers, they have caught him in this nation's greatest lies since Nixon (Wasn't he a Republican?? :D )
Bush's reaction to the attacks when in Florida
"Not knowing what to do, with no one telling him what to do, and no Secret Service rushing in to take him to safety, Mr. Bush just sat there and continued to read 'My Pet Goat' with the children."

The actual title of the book he is reading is:

Reading Mastery II, Storybook 1, by Siegfried Engelmann and Elaine Bruner.
ISBN 0574101284
Publisher SRA/MacMillan/Mcgraw Hill

The story he is reading is "The Pet Goat" in Lesson 60 on page 153
Wow!!!! Based on that huge "deceit", I would imagine everything else is "just as wrong"....
 
I think this sums up my attitude about documentaries, as was posted elsewhere:

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Documentary n. doc·u·men·ta·ry
A work, such as a film or television program, presenting political, social, or historical subject matter in a factual and informative manner and often consisting of actual news films or interviews accompanied by narration.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
fac´tu`al Pronunciation: făk`tũ´al
1. of or pertaining to facts; as, factual inaccuracies.
2. containing only facts (as contrasted with opinions or speculations); as, a factual report.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I guess it bowls down to truth in labeling - Moore's movie makes a mockery of the term documentary, and he has even stopped calling it that himself. I won't type more, since you can't afford DSL or cable and have to rely upon the 56k dial-up connection....
 
2 is 2, it came out 1 out of 268. What proportion do you get out of that Elkgunner?

You're argueing its 1, because 1 doesn't count.
Ok, argue away.
 
I will t y p e slowly and use little space so EG can get it on his dial up connection -

Quote: Why on earth would a filmmaker want to make a movie, but remove any of their bias???


Hmm - could be to:

1. entertain

or

2. present facts or the truth about a situation when those are enough to persuade a reasonable person or to simply make people aware of the factual situation and allow them to come to their own conclusions - as in educate.

Facts may certainly persuade one to a certain point of view, and one that is more valid than a sophomoric attempt at film-making applauded by pot-smoking college students, left-wing extremists, Hollywood intellectuals and pseudo-sophisticates. :rolleyes:
 
I'm still waiting for Tom to tell us what the actual probability of a Congressman's kid being in Iraq, based on the fact that there was either 1 or 0 in Iraq. Not at all 2, like you claimed.

But I will agree with you, I will always have more wit than facts..... :cool:
 
I'm still waiting to see how you came to be a judge of saw work, and how I could have possible back stabbed Moosie...
It couldn't have been my spelling or grammer, he would have stabbed himself to death well before I ever met him.
It could not have been the fact that I went to Warm Springs to see what you and Buzz were on about and I did meet a lot of your family their and they were wondering why you guy's don't visit any more. ;) They mentioned some thing about being ashamed of them or some thing... :(
It couldn't have been that I have dug a few hundred holes around the states to trap hapless horses, the subject is irrelevent to the questions asked...
So instead of skirting around or ignoring the questions, what would your answer be....
I wouldn't look at this as an attack, just a constant reminder that you are the one that pushes the hardest for others to answer your questions, no matter how far they are out there and how irrellevent they are.
So follow your own road... Fair is fair....

and we all just want to be fair and unbiased now don't we.... ;)
 
I'm waiting for someone to tell me how many Congressional members have children of "service age", and how many of those are fit for service.....
 
Ten Beers,

It is amazing how intellectually lazy you are, and have to wait for others to do your math and thinking.

Do you expect to ever get out of the 3rd grade? :rolleyes:
 

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