BH 209 & Proper Cleaning

[Curvebow]

I switched to using Blackhorn 209 this past fall. In the past I used 777 Pellets. The gun liked the 209 and shot well.

Fast forward. On a hunt, loaded the gun in the morning. 2-3 hours later, I see a big buck bedded , facing the other way at 30 years. I @#)(# the gun aim aim, squeeze the trigger & the gun goes click-pause-boom. WTF! Buck runs off unscratched.

Back home, I try the gun and it shoots OK. Why????

A month later, I'm going to travel to the other side of the state (NYS) with my son. I load the gun the night before. Late in the day, I get an opportunity at a doe, about 60 yards. Raise the gun, @#)(# it, aim, squeeze the trigger and ... click. I wait. @#)(# gun again, squeeze, click. 3 times. No boom.

The next day at home, I try 3 separate shotshell primers, all go click.

Email Western Powders, makers of BH 209. We discuss back & forth.

Issue seems to be that I used the same cleaners & procedure that I have always used with Pyrodex, 777 powder & 777 pellets. And, after cleaning, I coated the bore with TC Bore Butter. I've done this for 30 years or so. Seems that the 209 reacted with the Bore Butter rendering it inert. All of the primers actually fired, but with dead powder in the barrel, there is no pop, just a click sound from the striker.

For me, the verdict is not in fully. I cleaned the gun, a Traditions Vortek Strikefire yesterday, and loaded it with 209 & a Federal Bor Lok bullet. I'm going to let it sit for a week & see if it goes boom. If it doesn't go boom, then it will be the end of 209 for this guy. I have never had a similar issue except with older design in-lines and drenching rain all day that wet the powder.

Word to the wise, read the small print on the back of the 209 container and use only oil based cleaners!

 

[JDH]

This is good to know. I too switched to 209 this year. I used to use bore butter when I would use 777 pellets but would always clean the gun before season due to the corrosion the pellets caused.

 

[MThuntr]

I've only been using BH209 for a couple years but here's my process for all of my muzzleloaders. Clean with solvent of choice (I recently switched to Hornady 1 shot in the windex type bottle) or scalding hot water. Clean until satisfied. Run a very lightly oiled mop down for storage (I use Break Free). Before shooting, run 2-4 fresh primers/caps through on empty chamber to burn out oil residue. I've been using this process for the 24 years I've been muzzleloading and the only time I've had an issue was with black powder and those crappy Remington #11 caps.

 

[Aussie_hunter_JD]

I use Alliant Black MZ, I remember when I was looking to get into black powder reading a lot about it and Alliant came across as the most reliable. I've never had an issue yet with it.

I've never used bore butter, I just scrub with a wire brush to get the gunk loose then use hot soapy water to clean it till the patches come out near white. Finish off with some gun oil and back in the cabinet. Before the next hunt just run a patch through clean out a bit of oil and Bob's your uncle. Never had an issue with performance or rust

 

[mtmiller]

I am far from an expert, but are you using a 209 breech plug. I had occasional issues with my CVA until I installed the 209 plug.

 

[FrontierMuzzleloading]

I didn't read about you cleaning the breech plug with a 1/8" drill bit in that Traditions.

#2, I did not see mention what primers you used. Winchester W209, CCI 209M, Federal 209A primers are the best for BH209.

Also, Im betting your primers are dirty when removed after firing ( when it fires) Order a bag or 2 and install one o ring into the primer pocket. https://www.mcmaster.com/#9262k611/=rgsfbp

 

[p_ham]

I clean my mz with hoppes no.9 and run clean patches through until the bore is dry. Have not had a single issue with bh209. Make sure you are using magnum primers and your breech plug is "blackhorn approved."

 

[Timberhawk]

Do you need to have a machinist or gun smith bore out your breach plug to make this work? I've heard the recommendation before, but haven't wanted to go down the machining route.

I didn't read about you cleaning the breech plug with a 1/8" drill bit in that Traditions.

#2, I did not see mention what primers you used. Winchester W209, CCI 209M, Federal 209A primers are the best for BH209.

Also, Im betting your primers are dirty when removed after firing ( when it fires) Order a bag or 2 and install one o ring into the primer pocket. https://www.mcmaster.com/#9262k611/=rgsfbp
View attachment 80323

 

[FrontierMuzzleloading]

Nope, they squish down to size.

 

[hank4elk]

Hoppes & gun oil cleans BH easy,even after leaving a load in a year.
I got some BH cleaner/solvent & will try that for fun.
I have a TC Omega & never had a problem with misfires after switching to Rem. 209 Shotgun primers.
Never used bore butter. I use a lube stick & breech plug has only been hard to extract a couple times.

 

[F250]

I have been using BH 209 for years without a single issue (Thompson Center Triumph). I clean the bore with Hoppes #9,and soak the breechplug with Hoppes #9. If I am storing the gun for the off season, I coat everything with a light layer of gun oil. When I prepare it for shooting, I wipe everything with dry patches and fire 3 - 4 Winchester shotgun primers through prior to loading. Do not use the muzzle loader type 209 primers. Use regular shotgun 209 primers.

 

[stooge]

I use BH in my Encore Pro Hunter,clean with hot water and dish detergent, always run bore butter down the barrel. shoot 3 209 primers first and have never had a problem with hang fires or misfires, I know it is frustrating but I would be surprised if it is the Blackhorn causing the problem. I have to coat the breech plug with grease on my gun, if you do the same make sure your not over coating and clogging the nipple.

 

[gwhunter]

Do you need to have a machinist or gun smith bore out your breach plug to make this work? I've heard the recommendation before, but haven't wanted to go down the machining route.

My CVA had the option of purchasing an additional breech plug made specifically for the BH209. No machining needed.

 

[JDH]

Do you need to have a machinist or gun smith bore out your breach plug to make this work? I've heard the recommendation before, but haven't wanted to go down the machining route.

I have the old style and have yet to have any issues with about a dozen shots. I have not shot it in extremely cold weather though.

 

[TonyS]

T/C Omega. Hoppe's No. 9 to clean. Always BH 209. Use CCI primers not Winchester (poof and no deer at 20 yds).

And be careful with 209 if it is below freezing. I once left mine out in 15 degree weather and when I sighted in on a 3x4 buck it failed to fire. Keep the gun in the tent with you if freezing that night.

 

[F250]

I have shot deer with BH 209 in weather as cold as -15 F. We leave our loaded (unprimed) rifles out in our unheated garage all season (9 days). It is often 0 F or colder. We only reload if we shoot at a deer. Not bashing you TonyS, just advising of my experience with BH 209 and cold weather.

 

[Curvebow]

Thanks for the comments and suggestions guys.

More info:
- I use Federal 209 shotshell primers.
- My primers are not dirty or sooty looking after firing.
- The gun shoots fine when sighting in, etc. I think because I load it, then shoot it a few minutes later.
- I use breechplug grease on the threads, but am careful to not get it near the end of the flash hole.
- I'm pretty sure that the day I missed the buck I fired 2 primers before loading the gun to be sure the nipple was clear. Sparks were
observed coming from the muzzle, but yet the gun hangfired about 3 hours later.

The gun will be loaded a week on Wednesday. I won't be home on Wed. but will shoot the gun on Thursday to see if it goes bang!

 

[FrontierMuzzleloading]

Did you clean the breech plug with the drill bit? That o ring I know is a must in a traditions break action. I've shot 60lbs of the stuff over the years, with a wide variety of muzzleloaders, so I got some experience.

 

[Curvebow]

OK. I let the gun sit for 10 days. I went out on the back deck, put in a Federal 209 shotshell primer, aimed, and.... It went boom! However, there was a very slight, noticeable click then boom.

I cleaned the bore thoroughly using only oil based cleaners, like I use on my rifles. I also used a 1/8" drill to clean up some of the passage in the nipple. I plan to load the gun and do the test again. I swabbed the bore with a patch using Remoil. Then used 2 dry patches.

Right now, my thought is that I never had any issue of this sort using 777 pellets or loose powder. AM wondering why I continue to mess with the 209. In the late NYS muzz season, I used my sons gun with a 150 grain load of pellets and the gun reacted perfectly. The mystery is more poignant as this Traditions muzz gun, I have only shot with 209; having bought it this past summer. When the waether warms and the glacier retreats, it will be time for more testing....

 

[PrairieHunter]

Breech plug issue IMO.

I had similar experiences of failure on the most important shots with my Accura. See my recent thread on modifying the breech plug for BH 209. Boils down to not enough fire getting to the powder. They open the channel up and shorten the distance between the powder and primer to get proper ignition with the new breech plugs designed for BH 209.