AZ Couse Tactics

[asdew1880]

Got drawn for a leftover Couse tag in AZ and I'm looking for critique of my plan, especially if you want to take out frustrations over life choices/covid19/shortcomings in life etc... AZGFD lists three mountain ranges to hunt and I've got them listed in terms of priority. I plan on driving myself the 25hrs to get there, but may fly+rental car if it' worthwhile. I'm going to solo backpack hunt, and plan on hiking back to some roadless areas. My main uncertainties are:

1.Optics - I used a 15-45x60 vortex razor spotting scope in WY last year. I returned it because it was too bulky and heavy for me. Obviously need a spotting scope and was thinking the viper 11-33x50. Any input?
2. Water - Any tips on locating water? Using onX lists springs and creeks but I'm wondering how likely they are to be dry and if I can get clean water from them. If possible I'd like to avoid trekking down 1000' and back up everyday for water.
3. Camping - GoHunt lists this area as a concern for illegal immigrants being a hazard to camping. Seems unlikely to me given border patrol technology but IDK. Thoughts? Anyone who has the 30A Nov 6-12 tag want to share a camp (not tent)? Concerns about vandalizing my car?
4. General tips and things I'm missing based on experience??

 

[rustednuts]

1) I would go with big binos over a spotter unless you are counting the inches. There is a shop in Phoenix that rents optics.
2) You need to scout water in AZ, at times probably 75% of springs are dry. This is a major issue with backcountry hunts in AZ.
3) It is a real issue, with reduction in border travel, there are more packers and migrants coming over through the desert. Leave water and food outside of your vehicle / camp and they will leave your stuff alone. Actual threat is low but they are there.
4) Hunting water is a roll of the dice depending on the weather. Glass, glass, glass. Deer will move the first 1-2 hours then bed all day until an hour before sunset. Lastly don’t sit on a cactus.

 

[Bailer]

Rn is spot on with his advice.

Biggest challenge hunting alone is that you can’t take your eyes off the little buggers. They vanish into thin air as soon as you look away. With a partner one of you can stay on the glass while the other stalks or set up for a shot. Usually you have to help the other guy relocate the buck. On your own it’s an added challenge. Also part of the fun with them.

 

[LopeHunter]

Get up high even if only a 10' mound along a plateau. The higher you are above the flats then the more movement you will catch and the more non-vegetation you can look at to catch an ear or bit of horn. Coues are really smaller than Eastern whitetails and are grey rather than reddish in color which throws off some hunters from back East. Bring a hiking pole or two and will help as navigate up, down and sidehill plus can be used to lever prickly pear and other vegetation to the side as hike on the flats. Basically, if it is living in the desert it will jab, sting or bite you and is virtually impossible to walk in a straight line when you are on the flats due to the agave and cacti. I carry a camper's chair that is almost legless to sit in when am glassing. Keeps things out of my backside and gives my back some support. My arms get tired holding up optics though I try to use a tripod. I use a light tripod that has a bag that hangs down so can add a rock or bottle of water to help steady when windy. You can not overspend on a light tripod and a smooth head unit and ever regret having spent $100 too much but you sure as can regret spending $100 too little once you use a better system than the cheap version.

 

[asdew1880]

1) I would go with big binos over a spotter unless you are counting the inches. There is a shop in Phoenix that rents optics.
2) You need to scout water in AZ, at times probably 75% of springs are dry. This is a major issue with backcountry hunts in AZ.
3) It is a real issue, with reduction in border travel, there are more packers and migrants coming over through the desert. Leave water and food outside of your vehicle / camp and they will leave your stuff alone. Actual threat is low but they are there.
4) Hunting water is a roll of the dice depending on the weather. Glass, glass, glass. Deer will move the first 1-2 hours then bed all day until an hour before sunset. Lastly don’t sit on a cactus.

So for the binos, I've got 10x42s. Would you recommend getting 15s over a spotting scope? I forgot to ask about bear #s also. Do people generally camp with food out of the tent or not much of an issue?

 

[asdew1880]

Rn is spot on with his advice.

Biggest challenge hunting alone is that you can’t take your eyes off the little buggers. They vanish into thin air as soon as you look away. With a partner one of you can stay on the glass while the other stalks or set up for a shot. Usually you have to help the other guy relocate the buck. On your own it’s an added challenge. Also part of the fun with them.

I'm used to early morning late evening with eastern whitetails; usually within 1-2 hrs of sunrise/sunset pre-rut. Is that typical for couse early Nov? If so, that leaves a lot of in between time trying to spot bedded animals.

 

[Bailer]

Kind of. They seem to get up and move a few times through the late morning. But yes, finding the bedded buck is the ticket.

On the binocular question you asked the other guy... I personally have 12el’s. 15slc’s are ideal for coues, but I do other stuff too and find the 12’s to be the best all around. I can’t look through a spotting scope long enough to use one to find a coues. Your 10’s will probably also get the job done well enough.

 

[rustednuts]

So for the binos, I've got 10x42s. Would you recommend getting 15s over a spotting scope? I forgot to ask about bear #s also. Do people generally camp with food out of the tent or not much of an issue?

I normally run 10s first thing for the wider field of view, I break out the 15s midday when i'm trying to find a bedded buck as I'm really picking apart country.

Zero worry about bears, but pick up a lion tag in case you see one.

 

[bigsky2]

I think your 10's on a tripod would be fine. You could opt for the 10's and a compact spotter. If you're not counting inches you can probably just use the 10's. Having them on a tripod is the most important thing. Get your legs in shape. I had a December coues tag last year and did a backpack hunt. I had been climbing stairs regularly leading up to the hunt but when I was packing out my camp and a coues buck I was wishing I had done more training with weight. Glass the shade and like mentioned before, when you spot a shooter don't take your eyes off of him.

 

[CouesKelly]

As others have already stated, optics are a big part of spotting them. If 10s are all you have and buying or renting a pair of 15s or 18s is not an option, you can make it work. I think if you need to buy anything for sure it is a tripod as mentioned above. Getting stable is more important than magnification in my opinion. It helps you slow down and catch details and movement.
As you have probably already found in your research, access can be tough in 30A. Use land ownership maps like onx and have a plan on how you are going to get into the mountains you want to hunt.
Water is a big issue when it comes to all backpack hunts in the southern units. Streams can be fairly unreliable but there is water because those deer are drinking. It is mostly cattle tanks that I am not sure I would feel comfortable drinking from without the best filtration and purification. I would consider making a water cache drop trip in and then come back and hike your gear in if you are worried about it.
One tip I would give you is locate your water sources before hand not only for your own self, but depending on how scare water is or the current Temps, the deer may be hitting water more often. If it is hot and dry then sitting water midday can be a viable strategy.
Good luck and have fun!

 

[LaSportsman]

Sometimes they don't start moving until an hour or so after first light. One thing is for sure, they are hard little buggers to spot and earn their name as ghosts. One appears and then is gone. I watched a doe bed down and would still have trouble finding her when I would check to see if she was still there.

 

[asdew1880]

I think your 10's on a tripod would be fine. You could opt for the 10's and a compact spotter. If you're not counting inches you can probably just use the 10's. Having them on a tripod is the most important thing. Get your legs in shape. I had a December coues tag last year and did a backpack hunt. I had been climbing stairs regularly leading up to the hunt but when I was packing out my camp and a coues buck I was wishing I had done more training with weight. Glass the shade and like mentioned before, when you spot a shooter don't take your eyes off of him.

Great advice, I've added a 50# play sand bag to my pack for training. I've finally learned after three western hunts that I need to train more. Hopefully I learn this time! I will probably use my 10s and pick up a 11-33 spotter from vortex.

 

[asdew1880]

I normally run 10s first thing for the wider field of view, I break out the 15s midday when i'm trying to find a bedded buck as I'm really picking apart country.

Zero worry about bears, but pick up a lion tag in case you see one.

And when you are looking for glassing spots, are you looking to see the biggest area from your glassing spots or do you need to get in a little closer to pick apart a specific canyon/draw? My #1 spot is about 3 miles back and I can glass across canyon if I follow the main ridge for a mile or two. If I go this way, I'll be about 1/2 mile away glassing across canyon. What are your first spots to cross off when e-scouting? I can't tell if some of the more green areas are really dense and tall trees so I should cross em off the list or are they go to spots.

 

[asdew1880]

As others have already stated, optics are a big part of spotting them. If 10s are all you have and buying or renting a pair of 15s or 18s is not an option, you can make it work. I think if you need to buy anything for sure it is a tripod as mentioned above. Getting stable is more important than magnification in my opinion. It helps you slow down and catch details and movement.
As you have probably already found in your research, access can be tough in 30A. Use land ownership maps like onx and have a plan on how you are going to get into the mountains you want to hunt.
Water is a big issue when it comes to all backpack hunts in the southern units. Streams can be fairly unreliable but there is water because those deer are drinking. It is mostly cattle tanks that I am not sure I would feel comfortable drinking from without the best filtration and purification. I would consider making a water cache drop trip in and then come back and hike your gear in if you are worried about it.
One tip I would give you is locate your water sources before hand not only for your own self, but depending on how scare water is or the current Temps, the deer may be hitting water more often. If it is hot and dry then sitting water midday can be a viable strategy.
Good luck and have fun!

Thanks! I'm really impressed with AZFGD website compared to most other states. They clearly tell access routes and what roads are closed and some key spots to focus on. I've got a decent tripod that I've used on one hut and I like it. I agree on the cattle tanks not being smart to drink from; I'll make water the first priority and depending on my pack weight and training I might haul in some water prior to camp. If anyone wants to share "water holes" I'd be appreciative.

 

[bigsky2]

When doing your e-scouting, some of those big drainages look really nice but when you get there they are way bigger than you thought. Don't overlook the little cuts where if you spotted something you would actually be in rifle range. Some of those coues bucks have really small home ranges and they can get big living in those little spots.

 

[asdew1880]

Maybe last question: There are a couple burn areas, do couse tend to use bun areas like mule deer/elk??

 

[CouesKelly]

Maybe last question: There are a couple burn areas, do couse tend to use bun areas like mule deer/elk??

They sure do. Look for areas where burns are next to good cover areas. These areas offer great feed and cover situations and can hold some good bucks.

 

[rustednuts]

Coues home ranges are often 1 or so, they sometimes will never leave a canyon. Get the books deer of the Southwest and listen to Jay Scott’s podcast on coues deer. That will take you far. Hunting them is very different from traditional whitetail

 

[asdew1880]

Sure thing, listened to Remi Warren on vortex podcast today. First hour was great info, alot of what you were saying. He also recommended the book; 35$ on Amazon two days to my door Got some good camping and safety advice from the podcast too.

 

[coueshunter]

They don't call them the Gray Ghost's of the desert for nothing! Big binos (15x60) is what I've been using for the last 25 years. You can spot deer further than you would want to walk! You only need a spotting scope if you are concerned for measurements (as someone else had mentioned).
Hunt all day, I have shot a lot of coues around 2 PM. They like to bed on North facing slopes and mesquite flats. Also it can be very windy at times and the deer do not move much.

Good luck!